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Gaspar, Lewwyn, et al go full Sartre

Alright, so I was feeling lazy for a bunch of reasons so instead of a big t150 report you get a t151 report. I will probably in fact split it into pieces - I'll give a run through of the cities now along with a bit of other commentary then later on either this turn or next try and get a mapstitch and some other overview-y type stuff.

So let's take a tour of the empire. I'll give shots of every city and then a few brief words about all of them. I'm also going to pretend that we have a late game here instead of a concession to TBS within 40t, which is by far the most likely outcome.

I should also note, all of these cities are bit smaller than I normally keep them thanks to a few rounds of heavy whipping to put together the army. If all goes according to plan, there will be very little whipping after this.

Valhalla



The capital has pulled a ton of weight this game, as it always does. Early on it fueled growth by building lots of foodhammer units - since then it has mostly built units. I should have snuck a stable in there at some point, because it has built a fair few Knights but time, essence and all that. Thoth went Mercantilism last turn which means I'm getting no foreign TR any longer, which sucks, obviously. Anyway, its a bureaucap, so its importance is increased. I don't really see a scenario in which I'll go with Nationalism or Free Speech long term, so it will probably always be a bureaucap. If I decide to GA 2 and 3 close together, its possible there might be a drafting pit stop, but we'll see.

Eden



The second city has been the primary producer of GPs, generating 3 of the 4 so far and certainly will produce at least one more before hopefully being usurped by a NatEpic city later game. Its days of doing anything else are over, however, and it has been producing a little bit of wealth for a long time. Its possible later game I chunk off some of that food to Shangi-La or Agartha, but unlikely. Might do some workshops later game if I'm able to get a better GP farm together. Might still just do wealth builds, just more of them.

Cockaigne



The 3rd city is the primary hammer producer in the empire and has been pretty much all game. In addition to banging out my only wonder, the MoM, it has by far built more units than any other city, being responsible for many of the empires Axes and Spears in addition to about half the Horse Archers and a fair few Knights. While late game it will be usurped by some workshop paradise, most likely, its still the most likely Heroic Epic city once I have a unit eligible for that. I'm contractually obligated to mention Lewwyn wanted this city and I didn't, I would have split this into two cities. Its certainly worked out well.

Atlantis



Atlantis has been the strongest city in the east, generating lots of income and being able to pump out hammers when configured that way as well. It also generated a GP during the last golden age. As it turns out, double fish is pretty good. It has generated a fair bit of workers/settlers and of late, has pushed military

El Dorado



El Dorado was supposed to be the junction to the killer Moai city but unfortunately it never happened. We just didn't realize how close Oxy was and didn't get there. One of our three/four biggest mistakes this game. Anyway, El Dorado has been pretty solid as a hybrid city, generating a fair bit of commerce and a respectable amount of hammers. It has produced more units than any city outside of Cockaigne, though I expect that will fade as time goes on since it doesn't have the long term potential of some other sites. That gold tile was our first happiness resource and the commerce from it was critical in escaping the pre-Currency economic crash.

Ys



The clams city, as it was oft referred to pre-settling is the Taoist holy city. Beyond that, we sort of split the difference a bit in constructing it - those young hamlets should probably be a workshop and a farm - but nonetheless it produces just enough to be useful. Prior to the mobilization campaign it was the Missionary producer and will probably resume that duty once I feel I can lay off units. Not sure when I can lay off units with TBS just a couple turns from Rifling.

Shangri-La



This was the first great "carve from jungle" project and the decision to prioritize this location and Iron Working with it was one of the big mistakes of the game, IMO. Even though early happies are important and obviously the Gems tile itself is good for commerce, carving from Jungle is so expensive both in terms of beakers and worker turns I think it set us back from Currency which was such a critical economic tech we didn't catch up to the others til too late.

Quivira



Quivira is the other, better gold city. Its location on the TBS front has meant it never quite got the opportunity to grow into full flower and it also has had many other jobs for us. It will produce the next GP, which will most likely be an artist, though it goes without saying a low-odds engineer would be welcome.

Asgard



Asgard is the better of the northeastern holdings, though it was a city we went hardcore commerce when a slightly more hybrid approach might have been superior. Nonetheless, its generated a good bit of gold/science and build a fair few units for the northeastern front. It will continue to build a few cheap defensive units before finding its destiny on permanent wealth builds.

Jotunheim



Jotunheim was suppsoed to be little more than a linking city to Hyberborea (the city we lost to TBS) and points east. You can see the inane tundra cottage we'll never work there as well. Nonetheless, it build a fair few Horse Archers and has since spammed out cheaper defensive units. We'll sneak a forge in here at some point and then it will probably continue to build whatever is the cheapest, useful unit to fend off a future TBS incursion. That probably means a whole lot of siege.

Tartarus



Tartarus was the replacement Moai after the better site was invalidated by Oxy and is proof that a faster Moai is important - once you get that down, the city explodes. You're currently looking at a city that's casually spitting out 24 base commerce and 26 base hammers and still growing. A rarity as well - you don't often see a Moai with no seafood. Four 3/1/2 tiles aren't bad, though and those workshops will be better in 2 turns.

Avalon



Avalon has been hurt by some recent whipping but it was planted more for what it gave the empire than what it does, being planted for the Silk tiles. Other than that, it gives us some units from time to time.

Nysa



Nysa is the linking city between the core and the SW cities that Lewwyn was so focused on claiming. Its okay. Not a lot to say about it beyond that. Its another city whose longterm future probably involves getting the forge done finally and then building wealth.

Camelot



Camelot was planted to reach Elysian Fields and when not impetuously whipped generates a decent amount of production. The fair bits of coast and Peak tiles mean it will never be an All-Star but it serves a purpose.

Elysian Fields



We debated the placement of this city quite a bit. I think given everything that happened, the current spot is superior but if dtay didn't fold, we might have been happier 1 west. Nonetheless, it has been and will continue to be a solid secondary producer. Really need to get that Courthouse down, though.

Agartha



Probably the most useless city in the empire, since Nifelheim might suck harder but this city really just served to make Axis Mundi less of a reach.

Scholomance



There's a reason we called this mediocre wheat before we settled it. It does capture that Wheat, though.

Axis Mundi



The furthest SE of the cities, it makes a pretty solid secondary production city and will probably at a minimum be able to keep its garrison healthy.

Narnia



Another mediocre linking city.

Niflheim



The piece of crap iceball would be worthless if it weren't for IC-TRs. After that Courthouse it will build 2h worth of wealth forever and ever.

Lyonesse



The former Ike is the weaker of the two cities captured from dtay. Its potential to threaten our more key burgs was more central to earmarking it for capture than anything it will itself accomplish.

Shambhala



Shambhala nee Captain Falcon was productive immediately since it came with all those buildings intact. Its not amazing by any means, but so long as it can compete in the cultural battle with Commodore, it will be productive.

That's the tour. More later when I actually play the turn.
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
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To independent observers, while I'm having fun still with my own objectives, I'm fine with calling this for the obvious winner if nobody wants to play anymore. The amount of pausing we have to do in what is a 6 player game where one of the players is basically eliminated already is pretty absurd at this point.

I also find it absolutely fucking obnoxious the extent to which Oxy has done everything possible to ensure a back-half of a turn split in a potential war while playing all of his turns in 3 minutes. Hey, champ - here's what would help you more than getting a favorable turn split - actually paying attention to the game.

/venting over
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
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(August 19th, 2014, 18:14)Gaspar Wrote: To independent observers, while I'm having fun still with my own objectives, I'm fine with calling this for the obvious winner if nobody wants to play anymore. The amount of pausing we have to do in what is a 6 player game where one of the players is basically eliminated already is pretty absurd at this point.

I also find it absolutely fucking obnoxious the extent to which Oxy has done everything possible to ensure a back-half of a turn split in a potential war while playing all of his turns in 3 minutes. Hey, champ - here's what would help you more than getting a favorable turn split - actually paying attention to the game.

/venting over

PB18 spoiler:

If you (or your PB18 forum delegate) could just please go post that in his thread over there, maybe we can put a stop to the pointless peace time camping in that game, too. That one is eventually going to cause an unnecessary three way split if war ever breaks out between us. banghead

Edit: On topic for this thread, thanks for the comprehensive city report.

Played: Pitboss 18 - Kublai Khan of Germany Somalia | Pitboss 11 - De Gaulle of Byzantium | Pitboss 8 - Churchill of Portugal | PB7 - Mao of Native America | PBEM29 Greens - Mao of Babylon
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For the record this is why no matter how much the opinion of the community has changed I will always maintain PBEM to be a superior format to Pitboss. The issue here is that any competent player will recognize that in 95% of situations it is superior to have the second half of the turn split. So long as we allow players to determine which half of the turn split they get by when they play on prior turns it is objectively smarter to just wait forever to play their turn. And so the better half of the split is generally held by the player who is most obstinate about this policy. I did a bit of this myself in 16.

But anytime you have a built in mechanic that is anti-turnpace, there is a flaw in the system. Particularly as we are playing a 5.5 player game at this point, I'm virtually certain a PBEM would be faster in addition to being fairer.
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
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Well, you could propose converting to PBEM. wink

#fuckpitboss
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So after a billion turns of making sure he played after me... he played before me this turn, literally logging in 2 minutes before I did. :boggle: Which was the wardec turn. Much sad, such cry. [Image: biblethump.png]




Battle of Shmuel Cohen:

Green Mace vs Green Axe @ 26.4% LOSS (defending axe to 0.5/5)
Green Mace vs 0.5./5 Axe @99.9% WIN




Baltia, as it is now called, comes with a Courthouse and a Lighthouse. BTW, after this, I'm going to branch out to just generally any fictional cities so if anyone has anything they like, feel free to suggest. The naming scheme feels a little Commodorian honestly, with the sheer volume of obscure references so I almost decided to change it entirely but instead I'll just open this up a little bit to be less random.

Really doesn't matter how many times I play, there's really nothing more satisfying in these games than the first capture of a war. Maybe taking a capital, I guess. Of course, while this was the main event of this turn, it was not the main event of the war. The main event was me moving in my 2 stacks at Ovaltine Jenkins and Paddy Simcox. Unfortunately, doing so revealed another Oxy border city we didn't previously have vision on and just about enough of a covering stack to probably save Paddy. There's likely no saving Ovaltine but its certainly debatable whether there will be any progress after that. I say that because after moving all the units in, here's the full situation:






While he doesn't have a lot, neither do I. My northern stack is 11 Knights, 4 HAs and the southern stack has 9 Knights, 9 HAs, 2 Maces and a Chariot. I was really anticipating a few more units on his western border with TBS but so it goes.

Anyway, that's the turn as is. Thoth completed the Kong Miao and is spending way too many EPs on me. Oh, Thoth, why must you Thoth? Chemistry tech in @EOT.


I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
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(August 20th, 2014, 22:43)Gaspar Wrote: So after a billion turns of making sure he played after me... he played before me this turn, literally logging in 2 minutes before I did. :boggle: Which was the wardec turn. Much sad, such cry.

If it's any consolation it looks like he logged in at exactly the same time of day that he played yesterday.

Played: Pitboss 18 - Kublai Khan of Germany Somalia | Pitboss 11 - De Gaulle of Byzantium | Pitboss 8 - Churchill of Portugal | PB7 - Mao of Native America | PBEM29 Greens - Mao of Babylon
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(August 20th, 2014, 22:53)spacetyrantxenu Wrote:
(August 20th, 2014, 22:43)Gaspar Wrote: So after a billion turns of making sure he played after me... he played before me this turn, literally logging in 2 minutes before I did. :boggle: Which was the wardec turn. Much sad, such cry.

If it's any consolation it looks like he logged in at exactly the same time of day that he played yesterday.

Why consolation? He hurt himself not me. The only downside is I'm going to get back half of the turn split with like 5 minutes left on the clock consistently, I guess.
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
Reply

The consolation was in response to "much sad, such cry." Although that was probably firmly tongue in cheek upon reconsideration.

Played: Pitboss 18 - Kublai Khan of Germany Somalia | Pitboss 11 - De Gaulle of Byzantium | Pitboss 8 - Churchill of Portugal | PB7 - Mao of Native America | PBEM29 Greens - Mao of Babylon
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Chat.

NobleHelium
hmmm
invisible inc looks interesting
Gaspar
?
NobleHelium
it's a game
http://store.steampowered.com/app/243970
Gaspar
wait wtf
oxy is in the game
NobleHelium
WHAT TO DO NOW
Gaspar
well
NobleHelium
clearly he's like
YOU CANT DOW ME
IM DOWING YOU FIRST
Gaspar
i didnt notice it til i went to log in
i didnt even check because i assumed he was just not going to log in til i did
NobleHelium
sure, i assumed that too
Gaspar
he also hasn't applied the fix
so i bounced off him anyway
NobleHelium
well given that he had trouble getting a mod to work
i don't expect him to be able to change his hosts file
Gaspar
though i suppose its possible that caledorns thing is down
since it seems like its always down
NobleHelium
no, then the game would be down
oh wait
Gaspar
no
this is sunrise
NobleHelium
the game is hosted by sunrise
ah
Gaspar
i think thoth
also doesnt have it
NobleHelium
i don't understand why people are so afraid of thunderstorms
i have never shut down my computer in a thunderstorm
Gaspar
theres one other dude i bounce off of all the time
yeah
makes no sense at all
like
the odds of some shit happening
are really, really low
NobleHelium
well as long as you have a surge protector
you're generally fine no matter what
Gaspar
yeah, thats assumed
particularly since these guys are running servers
NobleHelium
ITS A THUNDERSTORM
SHUT DOWN THE ENTIRE DATA CENTER
Gaspar
lol
yeha
4 whips from oxy
its almost like he knew
if i log in
and he has a unit in the city im boating
im going to be pissed
NobleHelium
well you get second half?
Gaspar
yeah i guess thats ultimately better
NobleHelium
well
i'm not entirely sure it's better
to be honest
because he's already done the whips he would do next turn
if we assume that
whatever
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
my head hurts
#fuckpitboss
Gaspar
#fuckpitboss
anyway, im logging in
prepare for me to rage
commodore offers fur for banana
i thought i was getting fur somewhere
ill accept it i guess
NobleHelium
shrug
Gaspar
no reason to antagonize
NobleHelium
probably not useful either way
Gaspar
correct
NobleHelium
could be useful, maybe, in like 20 turns
Gaspar
wow
4 whips
none in the cities nearby
NobleHelium
clearly he was whipping unis!
Gaspar
lolz
NobleHelium
so uh
is your capital still healthy
Gaspar
i have 2 banana
NobleHelium
oh ok
i thought your second one wasn't hooked
at lyonesse
Gaspar
no
thats my 3rd
i actually have access to a 4rth now
from game and watch's 2nd ring
NobleHelium
you do realize it looks like you were camping the second half now
Gaspar
lyonesse isn't hooked
i dont give a fuck
NobleHelium
#fuckpitboss
Gaspar
#fuckpitboss
so no reason not to do the boating first, right?
NobleHelium
the natneg server is up btw
uhm
let's get some pics first
Gaspar
right
we havent done this in a while
<temporary links to pics>
anything else you want to see?
NobleHelium
let's check oxy's gold
he's 1t pp
i assume he's burning
but how much in the bank
Gaspar
518, 76 gpt
NobleHelium
1t pp but not burning huh
did he get a scientist
Gaspar
he got a Gsci ~6t ago
NobleHelium
ok
i'm going to assume he bulbed pp
Gaspar
well
NobleHelium
that should be highest in the priority given that he's done with edu and paper
Gaspar
rifles would definitely be a problem
with my army of knights
NobleHelium
well i don't think he'd get to rifles before you get to cannons
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
he still needs rp and rifling
and that is not cheap
Gaspar
right
i think its cannons after this for sure
NobleHelium
ok
so i think you have two choices
do all the scouting moves first then attack
scouting as in
you dow and then move solitary knights / galleys in
other choice is obviously boat the city and then do scouting
Gaspar
i suppose
at a minimum
NobleHelium
now the question is
is there any chance the scouting might cause you not to boat the city
Gaspar
theres probably no reason not to build the roads, wardec, and move 1 unit in at each front
but theres really nothing i can imagine seeing
that would stop me from attacking shmuel
NobleHelium
ok
so i think
dow
move northern galley 2SW
and see if you see anything new
Gaspar
it literally revealed nothing
NobleHelium
ok
attack the city with the green mace then?
26% odds
Gaspar
yeah
sec, im writing now because i wont later
died, brought his axe to 0.5/5
99.9, no reason to promote now
NobleHelium
ok
Gaspar
if i lose I'm pretending i had to shut my computer down for thunderstorms
NobleHelium
lol
well the chance of you losing
is so small
Gaspar
137g
NobleHelium
that it is less than what can be expressed in double point precision
so if you check the combat log it'll say 100% odds
since it's not precise enough to give enough .9999%s
Gaspar
got a lighthouse and a courthouse
NobleHelium
see anything beyond the city?
Gaspar
the two buildings i get cheap lol
i'll give you an updated shot
any ideas for a city name?
we've used all the good ones
NobleHelium
i dunno
i kinda regret this naming scheme
Gaspar
I was planning on Mt Olympus for Ovaltine
yeah
i dont love it in retrospect either
but it is what it is
<temporary link to pic>
NobleHelium
ok
so that's probably a tundra island of his
similar to ours
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
ok
so yeah i'd build the tartarus road and move a knight in
promote the victorious mace to c1 before you forget?
Gaspar
good call
I think after Ovaltine
I'm going to branch out and use cities from literature and such
because nobody has any fucking idea what half of these cities are
which makes it way too commodorish
NobleHelium
good point
Gaspar
I'd rather go off theme and have Middlemarch or Hogsmeade or something
than a bunch of random shit
nothing around the city at all
if hes prepared
i didnt see it coming
*i dont
<temporary link to pic>
NobleHelium
ok
move the southern galley 2sw to scout paddy?
Gaspar
yeah
axe and 2 holkans
yeah hes fucked
axe is c1
holkans green
NobleHelium
ok
i think final question is
do you want to promote anyone to sentry
any HAs that can be sentry?
Gaspar
yeah
almost all of the HAs are 2x promo
NobleHelium
ok
i don't think a sentry in the south does anything
you won't see any new tiles except the other two lake tiles
a sentry outside ovaltine would see quite a bit more, of questionable usefulness
i'd probably get a sentry in the north
promos on the HAs probably not really important
Gaspar
k
NobleHelium
no chariots right?
Gaspar
theres one chariot with the south stack, but no promos
lol
had no idea there was another city here
thats where his units are
NobleHelium
pic
Gaspar
<temporary link to pic>
NobleHelium
ok
Gaspar
in a sort of twisted way
NobleHelium
well that's not a lot of units
Gaspar
not knowing might be better
because i think this pincer attack
will be tougher for him to defend
and if i knew that was there
i might have attacked there
NobleHelium
well you wouldn't be able to attack the city out of the fog
you'd have to pile everything into tartarus
now this is interesting
very interesting
next turn assuming ovaltine falls
and culture recedes correctly
you can road the tile 2NW of tartarus as planned then attack the newly discovered city
Gaspar
that city has to be razed, yeah?
so funny
NobleHelium
well
you could keep it theoretically
slinks has 40%
Gaspar
i bet he was 100% convinced i was headed there
NobleHelium
so you'll have culture all around it
so how many units you got
in the north
Gaspar
10 knights, 4 HA for main stack
theres the trailing knight in the picture
plus one born in cock this turn
NobleHelium
ok
Gaspar
all but one of the kngiths are 2 promo
NobleHelium
trailing knight stays in tartarus i guess
Gaspar
in contrast
all the southern knights are green
NobleHelium
well that's good
wish we had more knights though
Gaspar
yeah
the problem is that better than half the empire still isn't much for production
almost all those southern knights were whipped
alright
moving northern stack to the attack tile
and trailing knight to tart
NobleHelium
so
14 units on the hill
if he throws the cat at you
that means you'll still have several undamaged knights at least
so the maces won't get odds
yeah that's fine
wonder how much fortify those maces have
Gaspar
a lone cat is pretty worthless
NobleHelium
hey now
never underestimate the lone cat
Gaspar
mace in ovaltine is full fort
NobleHelium
just ask batman
i mean in the other city
Gaspar
mace in guster is unfortified
NobleHelium
ok that's good
Gaspar
at least if the combat odds tell the truth
NobleHelium
sure
Gaspar
i know they bug sometimes
NobleHelium
only for rivers
what is in paddy again?
Gaspar
2 holkans and an axer
NobleHelium
ok
unload the maces next to the city?
holkans are resourceless spears right
i forget
Gaspar
yes
NobleHelium
ok
so you could take two out with the maces and then use a knight on the remaining holkan
i assume the holkans defend over the axe
vs the knights
Gaspar
yep
so boat maces to the farm
everything else to the rice
NobleHelium
uhm
did you move already
Gaspar
no
NobleHelium
does commodore have ob with oxy
Gaspar
yes
thats why i ruled out the banana
i mean
theres next to no chance
NobleHelium
well i don't think it makes a difference
if he has ob
oh
you mean 1 movers
Gaspar
yeah
i mean
obviously
knight gets odds on a praet
NobleHelium
well let's see
we know commodore has a road on the jungle nw of his city
which means we could theoretically make use of that road after oxy's culture recedes
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
he may or may not have a road west of that
Gaspar
ocy has a road on the dye
so doesnt really matter
NobleHelium
well i was counting whether
one less tile of road to travel
if you land on the banana
would help in any way
Gaspar
i mean
im sort of anticipating
everything has to head to slicks
NobleHelium
and it looks like
Gaspar
because i can see problems there
NobleHelium
it doesn't
well you'll be able to see
what is in gurtum
next turn
if you can take that the turn after
i see no reason not to try
Gaspar
i mean obviously
NobleHelium
i mean
Gaspar
the more size 10+ cities i take off him
NobleHelium
given that he has nothing in paddy
Gaspar
faster is much better
NobleHelium
i don't expect much in gurtum
Gaspar
because no time to whip
NobleHelium
so you land on the rice
Gaspar
and thats a lot of pop to whip
NobleHelium
take out paddy
well
actually you can fort gurtum and slicks
next turn
er
fork
not fort
so i guess it doesn't matter
and the southern path isn't really useful
so yeah let's go with the rice
commodore won't see your stack then unless he scouts
which is a plus
Gaspar
yeah
the more my power is a big scary number
NobleHelium
and yeah maces land next to the city obviously
Gaspar
and less an actual not all that impressive constitution of forces
the better
k
NobleHelium
can you finish chem at 80%
Gaspar
moving everything that can move in, in
well then
theres the rest of his army
1S of slicks
NobleHelium
which is what
Gaspar
4 maces, cat, axe, 2 holkans
NobleHelium
ok
i thought you were going to say like
20 KNIGHTS
Gaspar
lol
if he had 20 knights
NobleHelium
ok
so those dudes
Gaspar
his power would be much higher
NobleHelium
can get into paddy and attack your maces
Gaspar
and we wouldnt be attacking
NobleHelium
but not your knights
Gaspar
i guess
the mace holding promo
should get c1
NobleHelium
yeah
are his maces glowy
you forgot the terminology!
it's glowy mace
not mace holding promo
that sounds lame
Gaspar
something on the tile is glowy
NobleHelium
it's the top unit that's glowy when it glows, i'm pretty sure
Gaspar
k
so funny
that the main thing i was after
is the one thing he didnt account for
this is going to be bloody though
NobleHelium
in retrospect it's fairly obvious he had a city there (north of slicks)
i definitely didn't expect that very tile though
Gaspar
yeah
agree on both counts
NobleHelium
how many turns revolt on the captured city
Gaspar
6 frown
NobleHelium
do you have any cats nearby
can we get some
Gaspar
none nearby
can be built of course
NobleHelium
well i mean soon, which means no
Gaspar
how soon?
NobleHelium
THIS TURN
lol
Gaspar
lol
well no
i cant manage that
NobleHelium
is that elysian janissary whipped
Gaspar
nope
NobleHelium
how many hpt are we getting there
Gaspar
17 base, 21 w/forge
with overflow
it can 2t the cat
NobleHelium
ok
maybe do a cat there
Gaspar
or i could start cat this turn and whip next turn
NobleHelium
well the jan is useful too
Gaspar
yeah
tart can do cat instead of knight
NobleHelium
when he empties slicks you can boat it with a jan, np
Gaspar
lol
NobleHelium
2t on the tart cat too?
Gaspar
yes
NobleHelium
/shrug
Gaspar
could start cat in scholo and whip
that city is garbage
so i dont really care
NobleHelium
ok what units can get into paddy next turn
that we see
Gaspar
if he moves every possible unit into paddy
NobleHelium
yes every possible unit
Gaspar
it would have:
5 maces, 3 axes, pike, 4 holkans and a cat
i dont think he'll empty slicks with a boat 2SE of the city though
or E-SE rather
but two tiles away is the relevant part
NobleHelium
well it's pretty obvious the boat delivered the maces
Gaspar
i guess
if i were him
i'd move the pike and mace that cant get to paddy into slicks
NobleHelium
are the knights on the mace now
or you stopped after unloading the maces
er
knights on the rice
Gaspar
knights are on rice
NobleHelium
what about the dude on the farm sign
is he still there
south of narnia
Gaspar
i didnt move the trailers yet
NobleHelium
ok
Gaspar
so the 2 knights S of narnia
NobleHelium
dude on rice next to farm sign, he moved too?
Gaspar
havent moved
no
hes still there
NobleHelium
ok
he can reach the rice this turn so technically not a straggler, so not sure if you moved him yet
Gaspar
yeah
once i saw the stack
i stopped moving things
NobleHelium
ok i guess there's no way
to get any new units on the boat
ok
so 5 maces
3 axes, pike, 4 holkans and a cat
and we have what units in range?
14 units for him
Gaspar
1 c1 mace, 1 green mace
8 green knights
NobleHelium
let's say gurton contributes one more unit
so 15 units
Gaspar
2 c1/shock HAs
7 doubleglowy has
chariot
okys the kngiht that can get there that i havent moved yet
who is also green
NobleHelium
ok
Gaspar
yeah im not taking that if he moves everything in
NobleHelium
so 9 knights, 2 maces, 9 HAs, 1 chariot
Gaspar
yes
NobleHelium
that's
21 units
Gaspar
yep
NobleHelium
paddy is 40%
Gaspar
yes
NobleHelium
so 11.2 mace
yeah ok
probably not taking it with that
ok so that means you need cats basically
Gaspar
yeha
NobleHelium
cat in tartarus
cat next turn in elysian
cat in scholo
cat in camelot? maybe?
Gaspar
hate to whip camelot but hate to lose the war more, so sure
NobleHelium
cat in narnia?
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
what about further back
cock, nysa, shangri-la?
well wait
let's think about how we'd deliver the cats
Gaspar
i started another knight in cock but it can certainly do a cat
NobleHelium
really it'd be via the galley
which is only 2 spaces
Gaspar
nysas on a jan
as is shangri
NobleHelium
yes i see that
Gaspar
but they can be swapped for sure
NobleHelium
question is do we switch
Gaspar
nobody really is building anything that can't be changed
NobleHelium
well
better question is
how much time we cana fford to wait
to bring in the cats
Gaspar
well
i think a lot depends
on how much we lose at ovaltine
in a best case scenario
where we only lose a couple units there
we have enough to take guster if he doesnt reinforce it
in which case
pressuring both slicks and paddy
means he cant just keep everything stuffed in paddy
NobleHelium
yeah that's true
Gaspar
if he decides to give up slicks
then we can wait outside paddy for a long time
if he splits his stack
NobleHelium
ok i think you do cats in tartarus, scholo, camelot and narnia
Gaspar
well hes an idiot
obviously you sacrifice slicks for paddy
course
once slicks falls
i can pressure homeskillet
and same dilemma
so really oil can is the key here
if that falls
hes fucked
if it stands
im fucked
NobleHelium
well
if we can't take paddy next turn
i think maybe pillage the rice and move south to the banana
Gaspar
yeah
can threaten to move towards gurton
which still has the same impact
of pinning covering forces
we'll see
in a 3minute turn
its possible he doesnt consider much
NobleHelium
i mean
maybe we should move two tiles to sw of the banana
which means no immediate pressure on paddy
but it means we can threaten gurton next turn
Gaspar
well
all the same units
can make it to gurton
NobleHelium
and if he defends gurton, assuming not enough cats to threaten us, we can threaten paddy from the back
while his units are stuck in gurton
Gaspar
but yeah
i guess ideally
if we have the stack N-NE of gurton
then his mobile defense is worthless
NobleHelium
that is a kansas fork tile
not realistic
but the tile south of that
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
is realistic
we could move to that tile the turn after we move in range of gurton
and that still puts is in range of paddy
and assuming he moved enough units into gurton to defend it, probably not enough to defend paddy
Gaspar
yeah
yeah
the thing is
he cant ever totally empty paddy
because of the boating threat
NobleHelium
TOKEN GALLEY PROJECTING POWER OVER THE PACIFIC
Gaspar
lol
not to mention
he doesnt know whats behind
though i guess
he knows we have a ton on the tbs border
since hes had a scout there recently
NobleHelium
so yeah keep cock on a knight i think
Gaspar
k
im moving the straggler knights towards the front
the farm knight
is there a reason we might want it in north instead of south?
NobleHelium
well
it can reach SE of tartarus right
Gaspar
yes
NobleHelium
which is not in range of guster
so i'd say no
Gaspar
what about the mace covering the worker on the now roaded tile?
NobleHelium
are we moving the farm knights (there are two right?) to that tile?
Gaspar
just 1
3 workers
but hes moving to that tile yes
NobleHelium
let me get a pic of the paddy area
Gaspar
<temporary link to pic>
NobleHelium
what's in elysian again?
Gaspar
totally missed that comment
3 Axes and a spear
heh
forgot i had a bunch of stored overflow in scholo
guess that cats going to be a 1-pop whip
NobleHelium
ok
how much overflow
Gaspar
26 base
NobleHelium
anyway i think you either move the mace back into elysian or move it to the rice
does that mean you have a forge
in scholo
Gaspar
yes
NobleHelium
yeah nothing better to do with the 26 overflow i think
Gaspar
ran through the cities btw
cant do chem @80% without research builds/hiring scis
NobleHelium
ok
then don't
Gaspar
yeah
thats just trading apples for different apples
NobleHelium
hey man maybe i want some golden delicious instead of granny smith
Gaspar
lol
macoun ftw
gonna move the mace to the rice
because maybe we want it in the boat next turn
NobleHelium
are those hard or soft apples
yeah that's why you'd move it to the rice
Gaspar
oh!
forgot i finished a knight in tart this turn
so add that to the northern stack
NobleHelium
discovering units everywhere! soon we'll find some barbarian submarines!
Gaspar
lol
NobleHelium
did you promo any of the northern knights
Gaspar
not yet
NobleHelium
looks like shock knights get odds on the ovaltine holkan but c1 ones don't
Gaspar
do you want to log in and look before i end turn?
NobleHelium
i think you should promote
Gaspar
(not saying im ending turn now, just theoretically before that point since the turn rolls)
NobleHelium
maybe
yeah i guess
anyway
i think you should promote one knight to c2 and two knights to shock
in the northern stack
Gaspar
ok
NobleHelium
you'll want shock guys on the mace and holkan anyway
and the c2 is good for covering against a cat
and you'll probably want a c2 at some point regardless
Gaspar
yeah
i mean ideally you avoid shock promos since they're about to be worthless
but everyones about to have rifles
so all these knights are about to be worthless
NobleHelium
well knights on rifles is fine if you cannon them down first :P
clearly what lee and pickett really needed was more accurate cannon fire and some medieval dudes in heavy armor
Gaspar
lol
alright
ill log out so you can poke around and point out everything i missed wink
NobleHelium
ok
Gaspar
like the part where i mistook a bunch of 1 promo knights for 2 promo knights
frown
the northern stack is actually 50/50 on 2x promo
vs 1x promo
NobleHelium
fail
Gaspar
aye
large stacks make my eyes blurry or something
NobleHelium
well i guess we still have a couple double glowy ones left
so it's ok
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
ohh dude
your workshops are going to get +1h before production is calculated
that might finish some units sooner than expected
Gaspar
yeah though i dont think it impacts that many cities
NobleHelium
well i moved elysian to the grass workshop rather than the coast
Gaspar
makes sense
NobleHelium
wtf is baltia
i bet it's estonian heaven or something
Gaspar
lol
apparently an island of greek legend
where amber was produced
i asked you for a name tongue
NobleHelium
ambrosia or amber?
Gaspar
amber
NobleHelium
like, insect amber
Gaspar
everything on the list
is obscure or redundant at this point
I think if I get Slicks I'll call that Middlemarch
NobleHelium
well
Gaspar
i'm a bit pressed for even good fictional cities truthfully
NobleHelium
it doesn't look like guster has any good tiles really
other than the iron
Gaspar
yeah
thats part of why i want to raze it
NobleHelium
i guess it has a food that it shares with slicks
Gaspar
but i suppose there needs to be a city
in that area somewhere
NobleHelium
well
we'll see how slicks looks
when it falls
Gaspar
look at that optimism
how unlike you
NobleHelium
you know what you need
two forts south of guster
three galleys
morale GG
chain the guy and unload him next to oxy's capital
promote to morale
BOOM
Gaspar
lol
i assume
ill get a GG eventually here
NobleHelium
well i guess that doesn't work
since he needs movement to unload
so can't chain
Gaspar
far more likely he just gets turned into a medic
so i can build HE
NobleHelium
it's ok
your shock knight is going to kill the mace at 27% odds
and earn 5 exp
Gaspar
\o/
i'd say im due that
but i guess i got that luck already
i did lose two horrendously low odds fights vs barbs though
so i guess im owed one more
BECAUSE THATS HOW REGRESSION TO THE MEAN WORKS
/commodore
NobleHelium
3t for an 8% engineer!
Gaspar
lol
you're right though
if i get the spy there
i might have a thunderstorm
NobleHelium
lol
need a reload
Gaspar
natch
hmm
if we're pretty well certain an HE unit is coming one way or another soon
maybe I should do aest/lit before steel?
though i guess theres an argument
NobleHelium
maybe
Gaspar
that putting cock on HE over units
even though the payback is really fast
might not be a good idea
SHOULD HAVE SAVED THE FOREST
(chopped the forest because its about to grow onto the workshop being built)
NobleHelium
well yes
there's two cats
north of shambhala
that we could grab
Gaspar
yeah
i thought about that
NobleHelium
what do you think
Gaspar
i guess its extremely unlikely commodore is attacking
because as said before
if he moves shit out
he knows dtay has a bunch of HAs handy
so as long as dtay is alive
NobleHelium
has the number of HAs been increasing
Gaspar
we're probably safe
nope
hes totally gassed
fortunately for him
thoth and commodore are too
NobleHelium
yes everyone is gassed
Gaspar
well the other issue for thoth and comm
is neither wants to blink
NobleHelium
i was going to make a joke there but i'm not sure which of the stomach medicines treat gas
Gaspar
because the other could just pick up the scraps
NobleHelium
yeah
that
Gaspar
now that they're stalled at the same cities
knowing thoth
NobleHelium
yeah
thoth will probably attack
Gaspar
thoth is so weird
its also weird
NobleHelium
yeah
thoth is like good
Gaspar
how hes such a brilliant ffh player
NobleHelium
but not good
Gaspar
but yeah
thats exactly correct
like id never call him bad
but im not sure you can call him outright good either
the thing that weird
NobleHelium
i dunno
maybe we should move the cats
Gaspar
is id generally say his tactics are good
NobleHelium
and keep camelot on the jan
Gaspar
but he also took two cities
and lost them abck to dtay
who i would call bad
NobleHelium
maybe he was drunk
Gaspar
there is that
dtays not bad like kuro is bad
NobleHelium
he seems like a player who can execute the sullaesque expansion plan well
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
but he seems to have failed at it this game
quite miserably
Gaspar
well
biggest issue
is this was a terrible game to go for an early wonder
NobleHelium
GLH was it?
mids was later right?
Gaspar
both weren't early per se
in terms of overall benchmarks
he built glh first yes
but the bottom line was
with the land split so contested
because everyone was expanding so fast
i mean
mids is a lot of hammers even with ind without stone
anyway
NobleHelium
so
Gaspar
he didnt play well here
NobleHelium
maybe we should put camelot back on the jan
Gaspar
lets move the cats and do the jan
NobleHelium
but move it to mine tiles
4t jan, 6t growth
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
and we can move it back to coast when narnia grows back and can take some mines over
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
that is totally unscientific
ok
so i switched camelot back to the jan
on mines
and move the cats?
Gaspar
yeah
i mean at this point
i guess if commodore really wants to fuck with me
NobleHelium
if commodore attacks, offer peace to oxy and grudge forevermore? lawls
Gaspar
god bless
yeah
pretty much
i mean
NobleHelium
ok
moved the cats to the cow
Gaspar
im going to defend against tbs the same way i have been
NobleHelium
yeah tbs is different
Gaspar
but at this point i just have to "trust" comm
and when i say i trust
i mean exactly what you said
which is trust til he does anything vile
in which case i grudge forevermore
i think tbs could take jotunheim right now if he wanted to
NobleHelium
i gave the ivory back to lyonesse
Gaspar
since i only have 1 cat there
i think i could grind down a pretty big force at Q though
NobleHelium
i think your weakest spot is axis mundi
Gaspar
yeah
NobleHelium
but he doesn't know that necessarily
Gaspar
he could definitely take axis mundi
but honestly
i think thats off his radar
NobleHelium
and you could maybe try to bum rush westward ho
if he tries that
Gaspar
yeah
and westward ho is a pretty good city
so i dont see him doing anything that jeopardizes that
i'd feel so much better vs tbs
if i still had hyperborea and i captured the barb city that became westward ho
NobleHelium
well sure
Gaspar
you cant compete with joao on units early game though
since thats where all those extra hammers went
NobleHelium
thoth has a city with three religions
that's rather odd
Gaspar
that is odd
maybe hes going to try for culture
god bless
NobleHelium
i thought that but it seems unlikely
only one city that way
pl
ok
i'm going to log out
and let you do the honors
Gaspar
ok
need to take a couple more screens for the report anyway
lost thoths graphs
fuck thoth, dont you have anything better to do
NobleHelium
how many ep does he have now
Gaspar
116
i moved 10 to him this turn to get graphs back if hes not still dumping them
at the end of the day
oxy and tbs' tech is more valuable than thoths graphs i guess
NobleHelium
i would probably wait and see
and see how many points he's going to dump
before trying to get it back
Gaspar
alright
tbs birthed a GArtist
no new units in visible oxy cities
NobleHelium
ok
Gaspar
man
unit costs blow
NobleHelium
yeah
i would support changing the naming scheme entirely
Gaspar
the only issue
is you have to get used to 20 new names
NobleHelium
that's true
Gaspar
thats the only reason i didnt just go with it
i mean some cities its easy
but like if you say avalon
i know what you mean without looking
but whatever we change that to
NobleHelium
"chemisty"
Gaspar
fuck if ill remember random mediocre city in the south
k fixing
little extra change, just for you
NobleHelium
lol
anyway
i'm hoping your tech rate improves one way or another
in about 5t
Gaspar
well
im no doubt going to lose a lot of units here even if successful
NobleHelium
can you finish aesthetics with overflow
Gaspar
if i can stop needing to build a unit in every city
i can do some wealth/research
to get to key techs
which was the plan
and i think at this point
NobleHelium
no plan survives contact with the enemy
Gaspar
steel is going to be really fucking important
NobleHelium
yeah
that's the thing
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