Micromanagement Sims/Planning

[NobleHelium]

I don't think anyone is actually paying attention to the sim given the fact that nobody has complained about GM and ST being empty yet.

[kalin]

I like the idea of Moai in BbB if possible. Given it's probably going to be a border city next to a real competitor, having it on production seems like a good idea.
Kalin

[kjn]

Well, Wyn can pretty easily go back to ST if we want to. And we'll get our first WC on T96, and I imagine we will switch off building axes pretty much after that.

[Sullla]

I read through all of that planning, and I like nearly everything in this plan. The biggest question is whether we want to plant the two cities as outlined: the southeastern CFC border city and the wines/floodplains city in the west. I don't have a problem with either of these, and I think we do want both of these locations in the near future. They are probably a higher priority than locking down the northern jungle border with WPC and the German team, as neither team is settling new cities and neither one is likely to be researching Iron Working anytime soon.

My one question would be whether we could look to grow Mansa's Muse after it produces its two workers instead of building a third (6t) worker naturally. That city has enough happiness to grow to size 8 or size 9; it seems a little silly to lock it at size 5 and not grow the city to me, especially once Forbidden Fruit has its bananas resource improved and Mansa could take the irrigated corn back. If there aren't enough improved tiles in that area, we could simply run a Scientist specialist or two through the library and cross our fingers on a future Great Scientist later. Mansa is the city most likely to produce our second Great Person due to the presence of Stonehenge + Shrine, so I don't view specialist turns there as being all that wasteful.

What do others think? Is that a useful idea?

[kjn]

I tried to get MM to grow, I really tried. But the city is in a weird spot - it has two great (if shared) food tiles, but almost all its regular commerce tiles are food-deficient (gold and plains). It really needs both tiles if it is to grow quickly, if it has to work the gold and grow the unshared river cottages. NH concluded that it was better for AO and Ff to grow right now, and I came to agree with him.

That said, if you look at T95, MM is certainly set for quick growth. We should probably put two or three workers to improve tiles between FP, MM, and FF. AO is at its happy cap until we get HR, and FF has finally got its banana inline, so MM can use the corn. I imagine we will grow FF to size 5 or 6 and then whip a worker or settler, and that FF also can take over the gold at times, bringing MM to +7F, enough to grow quickly and get some grass cottages going.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

I don't think anyone is actually paying attention to the sim given the fact that nobody has complained about GM and ST being empty yet.

I noticed that reading through just now. What turn is the first WC due? I would absolutely suggest that it head SW to cover this area. Strength 5 chariot will manhandle warriors/axes from the barbs here, so I think this is manageable. I wouldn't mind the second WC to go to our ambitious FP plant in the west as a show of force, just in case. Those ladder guys may not appreciate us settling, or fooling with diplo, but they'll respect a proper garrison force.

I read through all of that planning, and I like nearly everything in this plan. The biggest question is whether we want to plant the two cities as outlined: the southeastern CFC border city and the wines/floodplains city in the west. I don't have a problem with either of these, and I think we do want both of these locations in the near future. They are probably a higher priority than locking down the northern jungle border with WPC and the German team, as neither team is settling new cities and neither one is likely to be researching Iron Working anytime soon.

My one question would be whether we could look to grow Mansa's Muse after it produces its two workers instead of building a third (6t) worker naturally. That city has enough happiness to grow to size 8 or size 9; it seems a little silly to lock it at size 5 and not grow the city to me, especially once Forbidden Fruit has its bananas resource improved and Mansa could take the irrigated corn back. If there aren't enough improved tiles in that area, we could simply run a Scientist specialist or two through the library and cross our fingers on a future Great Scientist later. Mansa is the city most likely to produce our second Great Person due to the presence of Stonehenge + Shrine, so I don't view specialist turns there as being all that wasteful.

What do others think? Is that a useful idea?

I like using MM as our current best-option GPP city. I also agree with their reasoning behind stagnating growth here. We simply need as many workers as possible to hack through the jungle. If we sacrifice vertical growth in one city to get earlier cottages in the jungle, that's worth it to me. And, as kjn says, once FF is up and running we can put the citizens back to work at MM on food. I think overall the plan is well balanced, if a bit on the audacious side for workers/settlers. But, I fully approve of this expansion strategy.

My only concern is that we are not using our early lead at Calendar and 100% locking up MoM. In the time that we finish Currency, Masonry, Mono, HR, then revolt and complete presumed chops/whips into MoM, I'm afraid that someone may race around the outside and snipe the wonder from us. How much of a lead do we have on Calendar at this point? This bears watching.

kjn/NH, thanks for the effort. This plan looks awesome.

[NobleHelium]

I want to finish MoM as soon as possible but those forests don't instantly translate to the wonder. We need more hammers. MoM is 450h. Pyramids is 500h. You know how hard it is to build that without stone.

First WC completes in AO eot95. It needs to head towards GM, yes.

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

I want to finish MoM as soon as possible but those forests don't instantly translate to the wonder. We need more hammers. MoM is 450h. Pyramids is 500h. You know how hard it is to build that without stone.

I recognize that. Is there any way we can squeeze out a WC to scout the south? If I had to guess, there's a marble down there somewhere, probably a fur too, mixed in a swarm of barb units.

[NobleHelium]

Well we're building more than one WC (another one is being started in MM while it grows, and we can build some out of TH as well). And the WC we send towards GM can easily head further south after GM/ST's garrison duties are fulfilled by the axe completing in HF and the one completing in ST.

And yeah, I've been guessing that marble is down there, but we've seen nothing yet.

[kjn]

I noticed that reading through just now. What turn is the first WC due? I would absolutely suggest that it head SW to cover this area. Strength 5 chariot will manhandle warriors/axes from the barbs here, so I think this is manageable. I wouldn't mind the second WC to go to our ambitious FP plant in the west as a show of force, just in case. Those ladder guys may not appreciate us settling, or fooling with diplo, but they'll respect a proper garrison force.

We can and probably should send Wyn back towards ST next turn.

We will get our first WC on T96 in AO, followed by an axe on T97 (we would lose whip overflow if we did it it the other way around, at least it was so in our earlier drafts).

If we don't want to build the Moai statues in HF, we can get another WC out of there on T96 as well, or just finish of the half-built axe there.

Then TH and MM will produce a steady stream of WCs too in the coming turns.

I agree that we should send our first WCs west, and then east and south. They aren't much good in the jungled north, except as a quick reaction force.

My only concern is that we are not using our early lead at Calendar and 100% locking up MoM. In the time that we finish Currency, Masonry, Mono, HR, then revolt and complete presumed chops/whips into MoM, I'm afraid that someone may race around the outside and snipe the wonder from us. How much of a lead do we have on Calendar at this point? This bears watching.

kjn/NH, thanks for the effort. This plan looks awesome.

Thanks!

As for your question, hard to say, really. We know that Apolyton got Sailing on T83, and that they might have researched Math as early as T66 (us T68). But they have few and small cities. CFC probably got Math on T85, but they haven't researched Sailing yet. I guess the only real competitor would be CivFr, but they probably researched Math on T83.

I guess it comes down to if CivFr has found marble, if they want to race us.