Gaspar and NobleHelium - More Arguments About Buildings & Food.

[NobleHelium]

yuris's second tech took 5 turns. 11 beakers x 1.4 = 15 beakers a turn. 5x15 = 75b, and Pottery is 76b. So he teched Pottery as predicted.

Mistabod's second tech took 3 turns. It was probably a 2k power tech. Hunting is 38b, and they had 10b overflow from Agriculture, so that's 3 turns.

Turn after that we see 21 GNP again, which should be Mistabod researching Animal Husbandry with two prereqs. yuris is probably researching Mining which is no prereq. Since we know Commodore switched techs, it's possible that davy wasn't researching a prereq tech and Commodore switched to one. However davy has been researching his second tech for a long time now so I think it's BW. Commodore's first tech did coincide with a 2k power increase, so it could have been AH but also could have been a warrior completing. He grew this turn so it could definitely have been it. Power went up 3k this turn, so that could be from yuris teching Mining (still assuming 11b/turn, he'd have 5b overflow out of Pottery with 4t of research for 44b + 5b = 49b > 47b). I'm going to say Commodore was researching Mining, then decided to swap to Agriculture. No real idea what Commodore is researching now.

Not sure what's up with the top GNP dropping to 20, feels like Mistabod swapped off their riverside 3f tile to a nonriverside tile...which means they either wanted hammers or improved a nonriverside 3f tile which is only possible with plains cow or plains hill sheep, but they don't have AH yet. Top MFG did go up to 4 on that turn, so I'm going to put that down as needing hammers for whatever reason. Maybe they wanted to go double worker start but put in a turn on a warrior first.

Summary: I'm fairly sure that yuris has teched Fishing, Pottery, Mining. Mistabod has probably teched Agriculture and Hunting and is probably researching Animal Husbandry. davy is probably researching Bronze Working, and I hate Commodore. Probably not doing this for much longer, but I do think early tech C&D is good for figuring out when someone is pursuing a religion.

[NobleHelium]

Fear not, for turn 14 has been played by me so no opportunity for Gaspar mistakes.



And yes, I did find Copper in my guessed location. It's a bit awkward with all that desert around it but we have some options for the city. 1W of the Corn is a decent possibility.

We're going to use waypoints as a general guide to our city names, but some waypoints may be aggregated with others and obviously long names will be shortened.



yuris grows to 2. davy got a tech and power went up 2k average (plus 250 for yuris's pop), so that's definitely BW as I guessed.

You should do some C&D for us pindicator.

[pling]

Oh and speaking of that, I've noticed that RBers often mistake east and west but never north and south. I wonder why...

I also have issues with left & right but never up & down, so it's the same as that for me. I dunno why that's the case tho, something to do with gravity making up v. down obvious but no such cues for L v. R? But I don't see why that'd necessarily translate to a 2D map which might be being held horizontal (but still with N to the "top"). Brains are weird

The thing that really does my head in is when talking about Ancient Egypt (as I often do, my husband is obsessed with it) Upper Egypt is the southern part of the country & Lower Egypt the northern. Keeping that straight breaks my brain in odd ways

[SadGit]

Upper/lower is indeed a bother, thinking upstream only helps a little. This map http://www.zonu.com/fullsize-en/2009-11-...frica.html
does help more though. The fact that lower Egypt was barely above sealevel while Upper Egypt was on a plateau somehow makes my brain more accepting of the naming scheme.

[NobleHelium]

That's why it's good to live in New York because downtown is actually south. Downtown Brooklyn is in the north though.

In regards to our tech choices, one of the lessons we learned in 29 is that it's generally better to improve resources rather than chop too many forests early in the game. We could have mined the Sheep as mentioned, and it would be a decent tile, but AH also shows us Horse which is often something that is overlooked. Horse could definitely be on one of those flatland riverside tiles, and would make a nice tile to work then.

And I just realized that I forgot to swap us over to Slavery.

[NobleHelium]

Played turn 15.

I think the world is upside down because the great desert is supposed to be east of Tristram, not west.



So yeah I'm not so sure that we're in the northwest anymore. There is definitely water 3W1N of the Warrior, so it's still possible that the corner of the continent may not be that far off. Next turn the chop comes in so we swap to the Settler as noted.



davy grows to 2. I also realized that I'm dumb and missed that Commodore got his second tech the turn that he grew. So Commodore could have been the one to research Mining instead of yuris, but that would mean that his initial beakers were put into a third tech. It might be possible that Commodore researched AH and davy swapped off a commerce tile while researching BW. Meh, I don't know. I also forgot to swap us over to Slavery again because I was too busy checking the sandbox to be sure that we wouldn't incur unnecessary civic maintenance costs doing it.

[NobleHelium]

Played turn 16.

I decided to move us southwest and...



...found Marble. It's too far away to be of use for the Oracle, but we'll definitely look to settle it for the Classical wonders. Desert hill Marble is about as good as a plains hill mine, so we might want to just settle on it...unfortunately that would also catch a bunch of desert which is crappy. I think we move SE next.



Mistabod gets their third tech, and power went up 2k so I'm going to go ahead and say that's AH. I also finally remembered to swap us over to Slavery.

[Gaspar]

Saw the save in my inbox and couldn't resist the temptation to [strike]screw things up and piss off NobleHelium[/strike] find out where Horses are. So I made the SE warrior move as discussed, followed the signs like a good doobie and whacked enter. This revealed:



No horses.

In other news, no news. Warrior uncovered pretty much nothing, as you can see. Mistabod grew a size, we discovered a tech and grew - that's the score increases.



Next up - researching The Wheel and looking around for Horses. Unless they're closer than we can tell right now, we'll have to bump that copper site up the priority list and settle it as city 3 or tech Archery. I've learned my lesson about not being able to build anything but warriors 30+ turns into the game. Just have to figure out how to settle it, as nothing looks particularly appealing in the pre-border popping portion of the game. 2E of the copper is a decent site but it would require teching Mysticism and popping borders to get the copper - something that isn't going to happen soon enough. It also wastes a grassland, but there might not be anything that can be done about that.

[NobleHelium]

Not a fan of 2E of the Copper. I'd rather plant 1N or 1S of that.

[pindicator]

Sorry, i've largely fallen off the C&D bandwagon when it comes to which tiles someone is working and who has what GNP. Largely for my games i just keep track of the different score components and maybe the population of different cities. The biggest benefit i've found in early C&D work is in determining which techs your opponents are going for, but that it isn't alwys worth the pain of crunching numbers on end.

Re: City #2, i agree with Noble. Either share the sheep for an initial boost to the new city, or get the corn in first ring and make it coastal so you can get a 3f lake tile later on. It will depend on what the warrior finds by going on thqt desert hill tile next turn. By the corn looks a little greener right now though