Ok, I'd better get the city tour up because the save is going to make it around again at which point I'll have no interest in doing this:
(Images spoilered, comments contained in spoiler for tidiness.)
New Tristram - Mediocre Bureaucap
This isn't the typical configuration of the cap - we chose to build Spiral Minaret here because we could get it done fastest. Typically, thanks to its Academy, it will be working the towns currently in Old Ruins possession. It is what it is - a relative monster for our empire but entirely too dry to ever be the full flower you'd like a Bureaucapital to be. Unfortunately, as long as the empire is so small there's really no option to go for something like Free Speech.
Old Ruins - Typical second city
It does what it says. It helped us get Settlers and Workers out in the early game and grew cottages for the capital, and can borrow said cottages when the cap is in production mode. Otherwise, its most notable contribution was giving up its last 3 forests for the University of Sankore.
Cathedral - Aptly named
The holy city for both Judaism and Christianity, Cathedral never gets to reach its full potential because of its position on the Holy Roman border. For the majority of the game it has been the city we get stuff from. Need some units - whip Cath. Need a quick GP - starve Cath. Need a holy city on the border with Commodore to maintain cultural control - grow Cath. If we had managed to get the Kiki location, Cathedral would be a much more valuable ville. As it stands, useful but nothing special.
Royal Crypts - Linking City
RC's main value is that it got us a jut to the south so that we were able to found Caldeum. It was once the military capital of the empire but after the founding of Alcarnus has receded to a more mundane life as a linking city between two more important hubs. It still produces a decent amount of military and often grabs a cottage or two from the nearby provinces to keep the maturation coming.
Wortham Chapel - Birthplace of Greatness
Wortham basically works tiles that can't be worked otherwise and occasionally supports the capital or Hidden Camp. It spawned the prophet that started our Golden Age and the scientist that will bulb Printing Press but mostly its just there.
Leoric's Manor - The Holy See
Leoric's Manor is in a lot of ways our empire in a nutshell - strong resource tiles and then a bunch of dryness. We built the AP here which was certainly the main contribution and you can see we've worked Priests when possible with the hope of eventually popping a prophet. We had hoped to use that to found the Jewish Shrine though at this point I think that's a lot less likely - probably just end up part of a GA.
Hidden Camp - Moai city
If Leoric's Manor isn't our empire in a nutshell, Hidden Camp is. Moai strength surrounded by nothing but desert and plains and constantly fighting cultural battles with Holy Rome. Yeah, Hidden Camp wins the empire microcosm award.
Caldeum - Hammers galore
I called Caldeum jewel of the south last time I did this and it is pretty accurate. It adds a decent amount of commerce and strong production while jabbing its culture to keep both Commodore and Yuri at bay. Main priority is military, but it squeezes enough other stuff in to be useful. We have half a dream of turning those forests into something some day, but no idea really what that is.
Khasim Outpost - MMM desert
Yeah. Sets the border with Yuri. Next.
Alcarnus - Late bloomer
Yeah, this is what you can do with a food resource and lots of grassland, or as I like to call it, Mistabod's empire. Not bad for a city founded not to long ago.
Dahlgur Oasis - Future NE city if we ever tech literature
About to pop a GP next turn.
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
pindicator Wrote:What are the odds that Yuri's learned his lesson about how paranoid you are and is still planning on hitting Commodore?
We promptly re-established Open Borders with yuris after the treaty, so he could have attacked at any time during those nine turns without us possibly thinking that he was attacking us.
I've already typed myself silly on this game today so there's really not much else to share, but we played another turn so here's the quick version:
Commodore adopted Theo and Slavery while popping a GA. Slaving in a GA seems silly, but what do I know.
Other than that, I really have no idea what to show pictures of. Yuri's army is sitting at Samsun still. Mistabod's land looks better and better each turn. Commodore just teched Alphabet himself so that GSci is going to bulb PP a turn after we did.
This was the result of about a 50/50 shot in Dahlgur Oasis:
Constitution is not in the short term plan, so we'll keep him on ice for a little bit and possibly use him for a Trade Mission.
Next turn is the last turn of the GA. We'll tech Feudalism then take it from there. Swapping to Slavery and Theocracy afterwards. Fun times.
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
Saw some wounded Phracts in Jumping with our exploring Chariot:
Amusing that I enjoy the video game that serves as inspiration for Mistabod's empire more than the one the serves as inspiration for ours. Dave lost another city to Mist this turn. Very sad. His power didn't dive much and Mist's did, so they're probably reaching the slog portion of festivities. I don't remotely care about this war - I don't believe either of them will win, but for rubbernecking purposes it would be interesting.
Briefly wondered if Commodore has a name for our contested border like he names the territories in PB5 (not a spoiler - I'm not even telling you what the names are!) Clearly it should be the Desolate Sands. Also, I hate Commodore, so not sure why I care.
The Desolate Sands, for those scoring at home:
No major updates beyond that. Like us, Commodore teched Printing Press last turn.
We teched Feudalism en route to Guilds (though we still lack HBR) and we finished off the Spiral Minaret:
Demographics took the predictable post-GA nosedive. Next turn we swap civics. Fun stuff.
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
We completed SM, as shown last post. (Really have to remember to turn wonder movies back off.)
Got our first look at the battlefield between Mist and Dave:
Also a Great Prophet born somewhere - Dave probably, just points ticking over from Stonehenge.
Made the post-GA Civics swap:
There was a lot of discussion this turn about what to do next. Here's the conversation, spoilered for length. I can't promise you its funny all the way through, but you do get to see just how crazy obsessive Noble is:
Quote:<discussion about looking at the Mistabod-Dave battlefield where I use the phrase rubbernecking snipped> NobleHelium: what does rubbernecking mean Gaspar: so it was faster to ctrl-v than to go the chat and forward it
refers to people jerking their head back to see an accident in traffic
often creating additional accidents NobleHelium: so you mean you hope to see the fighting with our chariot? Gaspar: yes
where did you grow up, mars? NobleHelium: i grew up in a city whose streets were not wide enough to fit cars 70% of the time
woo let's swap into serfdom!
commodore sure has a lot of uncovered workers near the border Gaspar: i had that thought
the workers, not serfdom
loss of caste is going to cause at like 2 more wealth builds, since we don't actually have any markets down
at like=at least NobleHelium: well
commodore teched guilds
>.> Gaspar: yeah NobleHelium: so, ideas?
in terms of what to build where Gaspar: well
looks like we're going to have to do a lot of wealth NobleHelium: ew
we're 1 hammer short on the ckn in cath Gaspar: yeah, i didnt twig because i assumed we wanted him born in theo NobleHelium: yeah that's true
hmmm
there is a slight chance that we could bulb banking next turn and also complete economics Gaspar: that would certainly be ideal NobleHelium: actually
i'm pretty sure we can...
we can do lib this turn Gaspar: well, no question on banking NobleHelium: lib is slightly cheaper due to commodore's discount Gaspar: uh what
guilds you mean? NobleHelium: lib is the same price as economics Gaspar: oh gotcha NobleHelium: hm
that reminds me
if we swap to theo this turn we can't swap to merc next turn Gaspar: yeah NobleHelium: maybe we should wait one turn Gaspar: if we're definitely going to bulb next turn
we should wait
of course
that means we do wealth in every city thats about to complete a unit NobleHelium: well we're definitely going to finish banking next turn or the turn after that Gaspar: of course NobleHelium: all right
it's time to whip out the BASE BEAKERS Gaspar: we could alternately NobleHelium: alternately what? Gaspar: not revolt this turn or next or the one after
because we tech Guilds> Banking (bulb) + Economics > Const (bulb)
and then we swap rep with merc
probably take a 2nd turn to finish const NobleHelium: we won't be able to do const in 1t
all right
current base beaker cost of guilds is 726
i'm going to screenshot this science bar
and see how much % is overflow Gaspar: im going to get a drink NobleHelium: all right
374 pixels of the bar is overflow
and total length of the bar is 448 pixels
so 83.48% of the bar is overflow
so we have 606 base overflow beakers
man this is fucking easy, should have done this before
so we would expend 120 base beakers to tech guilds this turn
with my current config that's 444 base overflow beakers + bonus beaker
lib is 1065 base beakers
er what am i saying
economics is 1118 base beakers
so we'd have to produce 674 base beakers to get economics next turn after bulbing banking Gaspar: lol
you actually measured the pixel length of the tech bar
that is win NobleHelium: well i changed my config a bit
450 base overflow beakers eot now
can we make 667 base beakers next turn
i think we could
but it might be better to swap to theo
what do you think is the probability
that commodore techs banking next turn Gaspar: welp
75%
I'd say that I could make a case for swapping theo/slavery this turn
going for econ next turn
then teching const
and swapping rep/merc after its in NobleHelium: mostly i'm wondering whether swapping to merc might help us make up the missing beakers to finish economics
that's the only reason why we should consider waiting i'd say Gaspar: how many additional beakers do we need to make econ next turn? NobleHelium: well swapping to merc looks like it will get us 8 beakers before multipliers
that'll be about 10 beakers after
which is not much really Gaspar: Hence why I like heading for constitution right after NobleHelium: well, merc is still good for the GPP
but yes obviously the constitution followup is a good option
all right
i estimate we will make about 592 base beakers next turn without merc
we need to make 666 base beakers or so next turn
without merc without research builds
i make
i mean Gaspar: i dont see where we get 74 beakers from NobleHelium: from building research of course
from the cities that finish units this turn Gaspar: lulz
we are playing the most absolutely ridiculous game of civ
HAY U GUYS WE HAVENT BUILDED ANYTHING IN 12T BUT OMG LOOK AT OUR TECH NobleHelium: hey man Gaspar: (not saying we shouldn't do it, just saying) NobleHelium: if we swap to theo
we finish no fewer
than 3 CKNs this turn
don't be hatin Gaspar: 3 CKNZ!!!!
we can take out yuri with that np NobleHelium: hold on let me double check
that we have enough hammers to make those beakers
man why can't you get decimal gold values
from building wealth
that's stupid
i guess calculation is truncated
er production is truncated
before passed to wealth
i guess that makes algorithmic sense
well
i think it's going to be really close
we might have to delete units tor educe maintenance or something... Gaspar: lol NobleHelium: i think if we were to do this
we need to put the uni at LM on hold
and build wealth Gaspar: i assume most everything is on hold for 2t NobleHelium: well i think we want to finish the CKN builds
to buff our power Gaspar: well yes NobleHelium: i'm pretty confident we can do it if put LM on wealth this turn
at most we might have to do a few ridiculous things like work plains forests over new cottages
i guess those cities can probably work scientists
instead of the plains forests :P Gaspar: here's what I want to see
lets go ahead and get economics
then afterwards tech constitution and hbr in some order
and then lets go kill yuri NobleHelium: THEN WE TECH PP TO BUFF OUR WINDMILLS AND THEN DEMOCRACY FOR SOL RIGHT BEFORE A GOLDEN AGE! Gaspar: i just dont want to keep getting distracted by trying to stay a half-step behind commodore which is impossible long term as long as the map looks like this NobleHelium: er RP
yes of coruse
we are not going to keep sprinting like this
after economics Gaspar: dont get me wrong
i generally favor sprinting
just think we need more land more than we need anything else right now NobleHelium: sprinting is now a pretty popular term in software development Gaspar: IE CIV5 NobleHelium: no
not like that lol
where there is a big philosophical movement toward small, successive iterations
over grand plans Gaspar: playing a game of civ4
is really about mixing the two
anyway, why don't you just send me a save with your configuration so you don't have to walk through and tell me what you did everywhere NobleHelium: anyway
we also need to make sure
that mist doesn't go ahead and attack caldeum too Gaspar: he may eventually
but hes not an idiot
dave, yuri and possibly commodore spoiled on him forever
hes going to want to stay friends with us
less so after we swap mercantalism of course NobleHelium: i'm finalizing the configuration
hold a sec Gaspar: take your time, im more of a foil than an actor this turn NobleHelium: ok i think that's good
there's a couple leeway options
right now DO and cath are working priests
because overflow hammers don't do anything next turn
and the food doesn't do anything next turn either
but priests only provide 1g
so it may not be worth it
i think everything else makes sense
you should check everything too of course Gaspar: looks pretty reasonable. swap engy in HC for a priest maybe was only thing I saw
unless we're using that in the hopes that the GP is an engy NobleHelium: let's swap it to a scientist Gaspar: ok NobleHelium: i set those specs before we came up with the banking bulb possibility and forgot about that one
i changed caldeum's
so this has some refinement and i think we'll need like 10b less next turn
probably more than that
so the plan is, if commodore techs banking this turn, we bulb it and snatch economics
else we return to normalish builds and do economics the turn after
unless commodore births his own GM or whatever Gaspar: could double bulb const after that in that instance
i think he'll tech banking though
which makes the other discussion moot NobleHelium: most likely
our breakeven is about 75% Gaspar: if ever there were a definite NobleHelium: which is actually very awesome for this stage of the game Gaspar: we need more land
thats it
its not awesome NobleHelium: well awesome in as much as you want it to be high, anyway :P Gaspar: its underexpanded NobleHelium: HEY MAN Gaspar: but yes NobleHelium: SPIRAL MINARET = FAUX ORG Gaspar: given we have no alternative
its good
if we can get a good chunk of yuri integrated quickly
i like our chances
probably build FP in caldeum? NobleHelium: i'd rather build it in refounded ankara
or just not bother Gaspar: hrm NobleHelium: i'd rather build the WP in caldeum =P Gaspar: thought you'd have been all over the culture
decent chance we never get a WP unit NobleHelium: you can always get a WP unit with a GG
10:24 PM Gaspar: yeah, thats true
probably how we end up getting HE anyway NobleHelium: i did tell lewwyn to build the FP partially for culture in 18 Gaspar: ok, chariot NW? NobleHelium: yeah
ooo
10:26 PM Gaspar: nw again? NobleHelium: yeah i guess so Gaspar: W? NobleHelium: ok Gaspar: heh castle
castles actually are really good against knights/phracts
since needing collateral negates their speed advantage NobleHelium: castles are very good versus anything that aren't immune to them :P Gaspar: well
less useful vs a 1-mover army
since in theory you have siege NobleHelium: yeah, you're right
BUT WHO USES 1-MOVER ARMIES Gaspar: >.>
<.< NobleHelium: lol
granary courthouse lib market in that city
rax forge hippodrome granary in mist's
all right
we should speed up chopping DO's forests methinks Gaspar: eh
still gonna be a few turns NobleHelium: IM and fast still need to road though
agree? Gaspar: yes
jailer 1-1 and watermill?
jesus
we have the driest fucking capital ever NobleHelium: we sauid we were going
to road the city tile first Gaspar: oh yeah
my bas
*bad NobleHelium: CKN into caldeum
shielding 1N and road? Gaspar: ok
harkuf and his camel should hang out there, just because
fucking camel, we're chinese NobleHelium: dude
you know what
we can build a canal from caldeum to the eastern sea
LOL Gaspar: ONLY TAKE 1 BILLION WORKER TURNS
750 MILLION IF WE SWAP SERFDOM NobleHelium: np we'll capture yuris's three remaining workers Gaspar: hahah NobleHelium: let's cancel shielding Gaspar: k NobleHelium: yuris is slightly more likely to notice him roading than him standing there on a desert tile Gaspar: you don't notice much in 6 minutes (down a minute due to losing cities) NobleHelium: ok hakuf can stay put
harkuf
100% on guilds of course
933/174/250 +13g/586b Gaspar: yep
lol NobleHelium: wow
dave on the score graph
srs bsns Gaspar: another WLTKD
WC for the second time NobleHelium: hurrah
man
dave's graphs Gaspar: yeah NobleHelium: it was kind of funny
how you were telling me that we needed to stop building wealth and research after economics
given that i was telling you that just four turns ago or so :P
CKNs are 7k power it seems Gaspar: well
i dont really mind sprint teching
i just want to get an army together NobleHelium: SM is 48g right now
i was thinking earlier Gaspar: is that base-10 or base-8 NobleHelium: we are kind of like plako in 25
base 8 doesn't have 8s :P
and commodore is kind of like mackoti
who was leading most of the game
got kremlin Gaspar: mack could have won that game if they played it out NobleHelium: well he was convinced he couldn't
and cited some pretty specific numbers
maybe him skipping factories for earlier wealth/research was a mistake NobleHelium: you know what we need to do
tech democracy and build security bureaus
Couple pictures to illustrate:
Many uncovered workers.
Harkuf and his camel.
Dave's "SRS BSNS" graphs:
Upshot of all my silliness here:
We teched guilds at a 100% supported by lots of wealth builds.
Pretty much guaranteed Economics Great Merchant, how fast we have to go to get it will depend on what Commodore does his turn.
Noble actually measured the number of pixels our overflow filled on the tech bar to determine our specific overflow.
Some combination of Banking, Economics, Constitution, Aesthetics, Literature and Horseback Riding over the next few turns.
Demos:
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
Actually, I'm pretty sure we just always build wealth. Also, collectively you two are more like ded-hecklers than than dedlurkers. Or more specifically, these guys:
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
So, just opened the save. Is it wrong that I felt like the dude at the end of this (EXTREMELY INAPPOPRIATE NSFW/NSFC/LANGUAGE/SUGGESTED DRUG USE)\ - the part @2:20 is particularly what I'm referring to)after seeing:
I've got some dirt on my shoulder, can you brush it off for me?
![[Image: t105aa.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105aa.jpg)
![[Image: t105bb.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105bb.jpg)
![[Image: t105cc.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105cc.jpg)
![[Image: t105dd.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105dd.jpg)
![[Image: t105ee.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105ee.jpg)
![[Image: t105ff.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105ff.jpg)
![[Image: t105gg.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105gg.jpg)
![[Image: t105hh.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105hh.jpg)
![[Image: t105ii.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105ii.jpg)
![[Image: t105jj.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105jj.jpg)
![[Image: t105kk.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t105kk.jpg)
![[Image: t106a.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t106a.jpg)
Slaving in a GA seems silly, but what do I know. ![[Image: t106b.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t106b.jpg)
![[Image: t106c.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t106c.jpg)
![[Image: t107a.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t107a.jpg)
![[Image: t107b.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t107b.jpg)
![[Image: t107c.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t107c.jpg)
![[Image: t107d.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t107d.jpg)
![[Image: t108a.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t108a.jpg)
![[Image: t108b.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t108b.jpg)
![[Image: t108c.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t108c.jpg)
![[Image: t108d.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t108d.jpg)
![[Image: t108e.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t108e.jpg)
![[Image: t108f.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t108f.jpg)
![[Image: t108g.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t108g.jpg)
![[Image: t108h.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t108h.jpg)
![[Image: 24256369.jpg]](http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l505/Lewwyn/24256369.jpg)
![[Image: statler_waldorf_02_01.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/statler_waldorf_02_01.jpg)
![[Image: reportcard.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/reportcard.jpg)
![[Image: t109a.jpg]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/16500814/PBEM38/t109a.jpg)