Posts: 65
Threads: 5
Joined: Nov 2008
My question was of course purely based on your recent dialogues with mh.
Posts: 7,735
Threads: 37
Joined: Jan 2006
After days of secret negotiations, I am finally able to present you with DeTOG:
Quote:We, the undersigned, formally acknowledge and agree the following:
An alliance (hereafter referred to as DeTOG - Death to The Other Guys) between the Indian Kingdom of Ruff and the Ottoman Empire of Dreylin II.
Whereupon on this day, t78 (120AD) the two nations enter into a long-term alliance until such time as the other nations are destroyed, or mutual agreement is reached that they no-longer pose any threat.
For the duration of DeTOG, technology will be traded freely between the members - regardless of beaker cost - upon request / necessity. When possible, a reasonable attempt will be made to obscure the level of cooperation from the other nations by making roughly equal trades, while recognising that some projects may require obviously lop-sided trades to take place.
Any technology deals with nations outside DeTOG will be by mutual agreement.
In matters of Defense and Offense, the DeTOG members shall cooperate as necessary to ensure mutual benefit and safety. All offensive actions will be agreed to by all members before commencement.
Natural coordination of Research, Wonders and military builds will ensure maximum benefit to DeTOG.
Dreylin II for the Ottoman Empire
Ruff_Hi for the Indian Kingdom
With an acknowledgement of existing trades:
Quote:Further to the clauses of DeTOG, Dreylin II acknowledges the existing trade agreements signed by Ruff_Hi:
A trade of Machinery from sooooo for Paper.
A trade of Feudalism from athlete for TBD.
Dreylin II.
Posts: 7,735
Threads: 37
Joined: Jan 2006
I'm sure that many of you lurkers suspected that something was up last week when I stopped posting endless chats & e-mails between Ruff and myself. He felt it would be best to keep all you lurkers out there out of the loop until we had finalised our plans, in order to minimise the chances of word reaching the other teams. I wasn't as certain about that, but anyway.
It all kicked off when I sent the following to Ruff:
Quote:Ruff,
I was thinking about your proposal last night that I research Education, and I don't think that it is the best course for me. Taking that route would leave me with:
1) No Forges
2) No Windmills
3) No Macemen or Crossbows (your offer to upgrade units for me really is not practical on any sort of scale for economic nor logistical reasons)
4) Duplicate-researching an expensive tech with no modifiers and little trade value
Let me propose an alternative route which leaves you in a position from which to win the game:
If sooooo has maybe ~5t left on Machinery; that means that mh probably has at least 7t left before he has Civil Service. From what you said last night, you have 2-3t left on Paper. That means that as long as sooooo is relying on CS as the gateway pre-req for the Paper trade, you have about a 4t head-start on him into Education. I would grab MC & Machinery (total ~10t) and then go for Philosophy (~6t) which would be due about the same time you discovered Education. We trade, then you go for Liberalism. Meanwhile I research something to make up for the Philo/Edu beaker disparity. We split the free tech and you keep Liberalism.
At that point if you wanted to grab Gunpowder, I build you an army of Jannissaries, and you go and take sooooo's land from him and thus become the pre-eminent power in the game.
Just throwing it out there....
Dreylin II.
Our plans have been through several iterations since then - and developed further as relations between ourselves and the other players changed (my NAP with athlete as a clear example).
The current plan runs somewhat thus:
Ruff will commence research on Education next turn, with the burning of his recent Great Scientist leaving an ETA of ~5t. My ETA on Philosophy is also 5t, and I will also switch research next turn. Once both are completed I will research Liberalism, while Ruff moves towards Gunpowder - perhaps picking up Literature along the way to enable HE.
sooooo is currently relying on trading Paper from Ruff, however neither has the pre-reqs necessary at this time. mh was not forthcoming with an MC trade offer to Ruff, so he has told sooooo that we have agreed a trade for MC once I have researched it. Note, of course that I will not be completing research on it for a while now.... 
Meanwhile, we will ensure our defense by my building Catapults (Ruff does not have Construction), while he builds Longbows & Crossbows post trade.
Posts: 23,566
Threads: 134
Joined: Jun 2009
:Popcorn:
Current games (All): RtR: PB80 Civ 6: PBEM23
Ended games (Selection): BTS games: PB1, PB3, PBEM2, PBEM4, PBEM5B, PBEM50. RB mod games: PB5, PB15, PB27, PB37, PB42, PB46, PB71. FFH games: PBEMVII, PBEMXII. Civ 6: PBEM22 Games ded lurked: PB18
Posts: 7,735
Threads: 37
Joined: Jan 2006
Krill Wrote::Popcorn: And here was I expecting "So what turn is Liberalism due on?" :neenernee
Posts: 1,285
Threads: 2
Joined: Jun 2009
What turn is Liberalism on? I assume it'll be Nationalism from it no?
EDIT: Also noticed that Mil. Trad. becomes available after Nationalism...
Kalin
Posts: 23,566
Threads: 134
Joined: Jun 2009
t89?
Current games (All): RtR: PB80 Civ 6: PBEM23
Ended games (Selection): BTS games: PB1, PB3, PBEM2, PBEM4, PBEM5B, PBEM50. RB mod games: PB5, PB15, PB27, PB37, PB42, PB46, PB71. FFH games: PBEMVII, PBEMXII. Civ 6: PBEM22 Games ded lurked: PB18
Posts: 7,735
Threads: 37
Joined: Jan 2006
Krill Wrote:t89? kalin Wrote:What turn is Liberalism on? I assume it'll be Nationalism from it no?
EDIT: Also noticed that Mil. Trad. becomes available after Nationalism... I couldn't possibly comment. 
Posts: 7,735
Threads: 37
Joined: Jan 2006
OK, so here's our current conversation about the plan:
Quote:Ruff,
From our discussions, I think the current plan is:
Dreylin researches Philosophy (5t)
Ruff researches Education (5t)
Dreylin researches Liberalism
Ruff researches Lit(?) then Gunpowder
Liberate - Nationalism.
A thought occurred to me that we may want to ensure that sooooo goes through with the Paper - Machinery trade, so that at least one of us has access to x-bows & Maces. If we hold off for too long he may get antsy and start researching it himself, so maybe we do this:
Dreylin researches Philosophy for 4t (1t to complete)
Dreylin completes MC
Dreylin completes Philosophy
Ruff researches Education (6t)
Then you would be able to complete the Paper/Mach trade on the turn we discover Edu & Philo, and thus blindside sooooo the next turn.
EDIT - on reflection, we may want to move my discovery of MC 1t earlier since I have to trade it to you:
t79R - Edu 6t
t79D - Philo 5t
t80R - Edu 5t
t80D - Philo 4t
t81R - Edu 4t
t81D - Philo 3t
t82R - Edu 3t
t82D - MC 1t (discover MC at end turn)
t83R - Edu 2t (propose MC trade)
t83D - Philo 2t (accept MC trade)
t84S - (propose Paper/Machinery trade)
t84R - Edu 1t (discover Edu at end turn)
t84D - Philo 1t (discover Philo at end turn)
t85R - (propose Philo-Edu trade) start Gunpowder?
t85D - (accept Philo-Edu trade) start Liberalism
You mentioned that Edu would be a 4-6t tech, so it may be possible for you to slip Literature in there as well if you wanted/needed to. I'm guessing it's probably a 1.5t tech and the overflow would ensure Edu was still on track.
Do you think that we can afford to delay a turn and give sooooo Paper in order to ensure we have access to Machinery's units?
Also, MC & HBR - Paper is not an unreasonable trade so if you can wait that long to get HBR we could do it that way, otherwise we can view it as a down-payment.
Dreylin II.
Quote:Sounds good. I am pretty sure that Edu will be a 4.1 turn tech (after GS) for me so I will have time to pick up Literature. Happy to delay HBR but will let you know when I want it for HorseArchers / Stables.
Ruff
Posts: 7,735
Threads: 37
Joined: Jan 2006
Big map is now updated in the first post!
|
