The Dark arts - C&D Master Thread

[Sullla]

On a direct beeline, we both need essentially the same number of techs:

Guilds (CFC has it, we will have it in 2t)
Paper (we have it, CFC needs it)
Gunpowder
Banking
Printing Press
Replaceable Parts
Rifling

This is leaving out all of the other side techs that both teams would want; for example, we are going for Engineering next, which CFC already has, and they probably want Aesthetics/Literature for their Epics and Education at some point. On a straight beeline though, we both need 6 more techs or roughly 15k beakers.

My best estimate is that both our teams will be discovering Rifling right around Turn 175, roughly speaking. It would then take CFC a little while to draft a round of rifles and move them into an offensive position. There's also the question of swapping to Nationhood civic; although CFC is Spiritual and gets free civic changes, they probably won't be too eager to swap out of Bureaucracy with their size 17 Academy capital. The real thing to watch is whether CFC swaps to Nationhood when they discover Gunpowder tech. That would be an obvious tell that they are planning to attack. There's also the question of "would CFC really attack us with drafted rifles and face a giant bloodbath when they could simply attack the Spanish instead?", but who really knows what they're thinking.

Short answer: I think that they can get to Rifling around T170-175 if they are determined, and we can match that same tech pace.

[Lewwyn]

Okay, I just wanted us to be aware of the possibilities and to be thinking about it. I do think its a worst case scenario, but as top dog you have to watch your back. If possible I like the idea of tech drafting them as much as possible if they beeline rifling.

[NobleHelium]

Uh, what is "tech drafting"?

[Sisu]

Following in their immediate wake for known civ bonuses.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drafting_(aerodynamics)

[NobleHelium]

Oh okay. I call that shadowing.

[Sisu]

There's a lot of terms for it, but drafting carries the connotation both of following them and of benefiting from being in their wake.

Course, that's only if you're familiar with the term (I have friends who bike race) or aren't thinking of drafting out rounds of units every 10t :P

[Nicolae Carpathia]

What's CFC happy situation like, and do we have grounds to cancel our resource gifts to slow down their research or distract them towards happy cap catchup?

[Qgqqqqq]

If we head for communism first as intended, what turn can we get rifling?

[Sullla]

I have no idea. Trying to predict where we'll be on the tech tree in 30 turns is an exercise in futility. Obviously we'll tech immediately to Communism if we think it's safe to do so, and we'll tech to Rifling if we feel that it isn't. There's really nothing more that can be said than that right now.

[kjn]

CFC whipped away no less than 17 pop last turn (though 3 of them can have been drafts instead), and have adopted Police State, Nationhood, Slavery, and OR. The result of that can be viewed on the power and GNP graphs, courtesy of APTmod:



CivFr is about on par with us on GNP (though they generate less culture) - I think they're on a heavily discounted tech. CFC really hurt their GNP with their new civics and the whips - with their SE they are more heavily reliant on civics. We will have to see if they can grow back the lost population at a similar pace to us.



CFC is the new clear #2 in power - I think we can assume they have 7 knights and 3 maces right now. WPC continue their buildup, but I can't say it's going that fast. The German power is still showing no sign of change, and the same is true for the Spanish team.

(I skip showing teams that I deem uninteresting for each graph, since they become too cluttered otherwise.)

Apolyton has researched Banking. They have 177g left, and are certainly headed for Economics now. With their low costs and high multipliers they will be able to research for a long time on that money, but on the other hand they have few civizens - only about 2/3 of us, so it's a race between them on growing pop and us on getting courthouses and markets.