Is nobody going to call Krill on this? Extrapolating poor civ skills, or even poor logic, to someone's intelligence is not a valid exercise.
Poor logic is not correlated with intelligence? I'm not sure what definition of intelligence you're using.
Well, I've met a lot of very smart people who are mind-blowingly terrible at strategy games. I think it's because they haven't had much practice playing them. We take that for granted.
But more importantly, what kind of argument is that? We're talking about judging a single person here. Krill didn't say that - based on available information namely his civ play - he finds Kuro to be more likely to be "stupid" than other civ players on this site. No, he said Kuru is stupid.* That is a specific claim about an actual person, and not about correlation.
* I realize I'm at risk of ascribing meaning to Krill's words that he didn't intend. For this post I'm assuming it was meant as Merovech read it. Personally, I'd have preferred Krill not say that. There were also some other posts critical of the players that I would rather not have read. I feel kind of embarrassed to be a part of this thread.
Well at least you're covering up the most recent 'last post' of my incessant spam even if you're not presenting a penetrating argument either way.
I wonder though sometimes whether logic is the be-all and end-all... acting illogically was a lot of the beef I've had with my past few ex-girlfriends...
Quote:Well at least you're covering up the most recent 'last post' of my incessant spam now.
Often when we perceive people to act illogically, actually they are acting quite logically.
The classic example is buying lottery tickets. Many smart people are quick to criticize people who do that, because looking at the expected monetary value, it's a terrible deal. But it could actually be a very good deal if it makes the buyer happy and thereby improves their quality of life. People regularly pay much more than a dollar for happiness.
For me, buying a lottery ticket would make me sad, because I would be dwelling the awful EV for me, and the perceived uselessness of the whole thing overall. So it's illogical for me to do. For someone else, browsing RB would be illogical and the lottery tickets wouldn't be. It would be a mistake for me to assume that other people have the same values and reactions to stimuli as me, and are therefore being illogical if they do things that I wouldn't.
Isn't the general arguement the reason that Krill made the specific statement on Kuro's intellect? Or did I not understand something?
Merovech's Mapmaking Guidelines:
0. Player Requests: The player's requests take precedence, even if they contradict the following guidelines.
1. Balance: The map must be balanced, both in regards to land quality and availability and in regards to special civilization features. A map may be wonderfully unique and surprising, but, if it is unbalanced, the game will suffer and the player's enjoyment will not be as high as it could be.
2. Identity and Enjoyment: The map should be interesting to play at all levels, from city placement and management to the border-created interactions between civilizations, and should include varied terrain. Flavor should enhance the inherent pleasure resulting from the underlying tile arrangements. The map should not be exceedingly lush, but it is better to err on the lush side than on the poor side when placing terrain.
3. Feel (Avoiding Gimmicks): The map should not be overwhelmed or dominated by the mapmaker's flavor. Embellishment of the map through the use of special improvements, barbarian units, and abnormal terrain can enhance the identity and enjoyment of the map, but should take a backseat to the more normal aspects of the map. The game should usually not revolve around the flavor, but merely be accented by it.
4. Realism: Where possible, the terrain of the map should be realistic. Jungles on desert tiles, or even next to desert tiles, should therefore have a very specific reason for existing. Rivers should run downhill or across level ground into bodies of water. Irrigated terrain should have a higher grassland to plains ratio than dry terrain. Mountain chains should cast rain shadows. Islands, mountains, and peninsulas should follow logical plate tectonics.
Man, I dunno about Krill's reasoning, but Kuro is obviously stupid. Less because of playing a bad civ open, more because of his general and complete ineducability. Ignorance is just a lack of knowledge.
If only you and me and dead people know hex, then only deaf people know hex.
My point is that even if you think someone's stupid, you don't say it. Only one's closest friend has the right to say something like that about them, only to their face, and only if it will truly benefit them. I hate to say this, because I hate to be in conflict with people I respect, but this kind of conduct is unethical, and needs to stop if you want this site to remain one of the brighter spots on the Internet. Criticize Kuro's - or my or anyone else's - Civ-play as much as you want, but cut the ad hominems. They are useless and demeaning, and reflect poorly on the poster and the site.
The reason I said stupid wasn't that Kuro made bad in game decisions: that wouldn't itself be enough evidence. However, I feel that given the amount of hints people have given him, he should have realised that he might have made mistakes. That he didn't realise given additional direction makes me think Kuro is at best single minded and at worst self confident to the extent that he believes that he is making the best possible choice. That, to me, is either stupid or delusional, and calling him delusional seemed even worse IMO.
Note: at all times I have been referring to his decisions based on interactions and actions on the forum. He could be a physicist at CERN for all I know, or a college freshman, and I would still feel that the previous paragraph holds.
As an aside, an Ad Hominem requires that the attack be without justification. That claim isn't, because there is reasoning to explain why it's made. You could call it biased, I suppose, or even argue that it's based off a false premise, but I don't think it's an Ad Hominem.
(May 29th, 2013, 10:21)TheHumanHydra Wrote: and needs to stop if you want this site to remain one of the brighter spots on the Internet.
RB has been elitist for a long time. It's a problem caused by the early Pitboss games. Those were the introduction many of our current users had to RB, and all of them included RB'ers calling others (either people from other websites or fellow RB'ers) bad, belittling them, making fun of them and so forth. For anyone joining in, it only seems natural to act as others have before them. It's embedded in our own little "culture" now. Which is a damn shame, I don't approve at all..
stu·pid (stpd, sty-)
adj. stu·pid·er, stu·pid·est 1. Slow to learn or understand; obtuse.
2. Tending to make poor decisions or careless mistakes.
3. Marked by a lack of intelligence or care; foolish or careless: a stupid mistake.
4. Dazed, stunned, or stupefied.
5. Pointless; worthless: a stupid job
In this instance, I feel that the words stupid (and conversely smart and intelligent) can be used fairly, without the worry that political correctness needs to be invoked.
