[SPOILERS] Lurkerloos and map discussion

[novice]

I forget, did they ban diplomatic losses in this game?

[The Black Sword]

Regarding Serdoa and Commodore; do you think their pessimism is justified about their chances for this game? In a diplo game, the answer to a leader such as plako seems to be a dogpile. That's hard to do in a no-diplo game, but with Bigger's CV attempt, they all know plako will go to war at some point in the future, they have a good idea of the time frame and they know they will have at least 1 ally, more if others are thinking that way, which is likely.

There's a chance you let Bigger be successful, but you that's still no worse than the current position(depends how you value 2nd, 3rd place I suppose). There's a chance that Commodore could attack Serdoa if Serdoa went after plako, but second fights third while first place mops up the fourth place guy, doesn't make much sense, why would Commodore choose that? There are problems but the chances for success is certainly higher than the current situation.

I understand if the turns are too long but they also seem to be overly negative about stopping plako.

[Krill]

I think the game is over, with the time frame Plako has given to get to DD, TR, and Arty he will just turn up at Biggers do with 200 units. Bigger needs too many turns. And even with diplo, no one has any reason to do anything to Plako until after he stops the potential CV because 2nd place would have to stop plako and then find the material to stop a CV that is closer to succeeding (and will frankly just have more shitty unit spam to through at a potential invader).

That said, I agree with the other posters views that in future we need to implement a concession mechanic on the forum. My preferred method is that the moment any player wants to concede the game, they just PM a previously specified lurker stating that they want to concede and to whom (could be "Concede to everyone" or just "Concede to player X"). Once a predetermined number of players have sent a message that they are willing to concede to player X (Concede to everyone counting as a concession to player X in this instance) then the lurker confirms with every player that has sent a PM that orders still stand and then posts in the public thread that the game is over. The predetermined number could be every player but the winning player needs to concede, or just something like 2/3 players, or even something abstract like players controlling 75% of the in game population or land area need to concede for the game to end. But whatever happens, need to be done privately.

[Krill]

novice, I think that diplo victory is still enabled, but unsure if anyone can reach Radio to build the UN. Sloww won't go in the direction, plako is focussed on killing Bigger and Serdoa...OK, Serdoa might do it.

[BRickAstley]

I think the game is over, with the time frame Plako has given to get to DD, TR, and Arty he will just turn up at Biggers do with 200 units. Bigger needs too many turns. And even with diplo, no one has any reason to do anything to Plako until after he stops the potential CV because 2nd place would have to stop plako and then find the material to stop a CV that is closer to succeeding (and will frankly just have more shitty unit spam to through at a potential invader).

That said, I agree with the other posters views that in future we need to implement a concession mechanic on the forum. My preferred method is that the moment any player wants to concede the game, they just PM a previously specified lurker stating that they want to concede and to whom (could be "Concede to everyone" or just "Concede to player X"). Once a predetermined number of players have sent a message that they are willing to concede to player X (Concede to everyone counting as a concession to player X in this instance) then the lurker confirms with every player that has sent a PM that orders still stand and then posts in the public thread that the game is over. The predetermined number could be every player but the winning player needs to concede, or just something like 2/3 players, or even something abstract like players controlling 75% of the in game population or land area need to concede for the game to end. But whatever happens, need to be done privately.

A Game Moderator would be a really good idea. I can do that for the next RB Mod PB game, since I'll be not playing as the map maker anyways. We do need definite conditions that the players agree to beforehand though.

[novice]

novice, I think that diplo victory is still enabled, but unsure if anyone can reach Radio to build the UN. Sloww won't go in the direction, plako is focussed on killing Bigger and Serdoa...OK, Serdoa might do it.

I was actually referring to Bigger "losing by diplo" since everybody is in effect telling Plako he can deal with the CV attempt without fear.

I didn't think about the UN.

I don't think Bigger's CV attempt was ever going to work, but yeah games should have a concession mechanic à la the one used in 47 and 49.

[TheHumanHydra]

Can I say something weird? I think (in future games) Retire to AI should become a legitimate option. In a lot of games, it seems one or more players are reduced to irrelevance, which isn't really fun, but are forced to play out the turns for months so more invested players can have their game. Retiring to AI would let "checked out" players do just that, but still allow the game to go on. Obviously a rule or two would have to be put in place to prevent abuse of the AI a human player wouldn't permit (say, "no proposing deals with the AI"). I suppose the AI could theoretically swing the game by randomly attacking someone, if it still had the strength, but this would be far less threatening than a human who decided to throw the game in a revenge war. The main problem I see is that the AI would be far easier to roll over if someone decided to gobble its land, but ... I dunno, maybe that'd just be an accepted part of the game? Anyway, just throwing this crazy idea out there.

[darrelljs]

In a lot of games, it seems one or more players are reduced to irrelevance, which isn't really fun, but are forced to play out the turns for months so more invested players can have their game.

That's the compact you make when you start one of these things.

My preferred method is <snip>

Krill's proposal is the best, fairest method I've seen so far to handle concession.

Darrell

[WilliamLP]

How about instead of "retire to AI", "retire to a volunteer" should be an option? I bet someone on the general forum would be willing to play Serdoa or Commodore's position here.

I'm not that good or experienced a Civ player, but I refute the premise that this game should be conceded, and that rules need to change in the future so that a player like Bigger no longer has the right to see it to a conclusion when he wants to.

With Krill's proposal, what if everyone but the #2 player wants to concede, but #2 still thinks he can win? Should the game stop there? Imo, no.

[Qgqqqqq]

Retire to a volunteer is always an option, and occurs plenty, but Id be surprised if anyone was unspoiled at this game - and besides, when it was raised ages ago by serdoa he concluded that he couldn't stand down because it would make things too easy for those around him (as everyone he trusted with the position was spoiled).