[spoilers]Oh Canada! Victoria has a Commodore, eh?

[Krill]

No change made to Angkor Wat.

[Ceiliazul]

Since it frequently appears on 'worst wonder' lists, i'm (pleasantly) surprised it wasn't altered.

So there ya go wonder ho. speaking of wonders, is Sankore still on the way? you said mack was maybe stealing it? (God knows there's no spoiler info in that question, he never updates! )

[Krill]

People are idiots.

AW is the only wonder after the ancient era that makes it possible to get a prophet for a shrine (I'll add the caveat without getting lucky): it has a potentially huge pay off in certain circumstances. Most that would ever be reasonable for it is to make it cheaper (and there is a case for that if the multipliers get nerfed).

[SevenSpirits]

People are idiots.

AW is the only wonder after the ancient era that makes it possible to get a prophet for a shrine (I'll add the caveat without getting lucky): it has a potentially huge pay off in certain circumstances. Most that would ever be reasonable for it is to make it cheaper (and there is a case for that if the multipliers get nerfed).

How much money does a shrine have to make per turn so that building an entire wonder and forgoing a different great person (like a scientist) is worthwhile?

[Commodore]

Yeah, Krill's right; AW is less about the 2h priests, more the 3 slots+ 2GProP, unless you're Egypt or Arabia it's how you get a late-game shrine.

I might get it eventually for a shrine. For RBmod please note priests can be boosted to 3b/2h/2g total, impressive.

How much money does a shrine have to make per turn so that building an entire wonder and forgoing a different great person (like a scientist) is worthwhile?

Maybe ~40gpt base? To be boosted 80gpt? The shrine, amusingly, does get AP/UoS/SM benefits.

...and yeah, Ceil, I forgot to mention, M_H is awesome and built the Paya for mackoti before he died. So Mack is in Free Religion.

[Krill]

People are idiots.

AW is the only wonder after the ancient era that makes it possible to get a prophet for a shrine (I'll add the caveat without getting lucky): it has a potentially huge pay off in certain circumstances. Most that would ever be reasonable for it is to make it cheaper (and there is a case for that if the multipliers get nerfed).

How much money does a shrine have to make per turn so that building an entire wonder and forgoing a different great person (like a scientist) is worthwhile?

Depends, but in certain circumstances, such as low commerce maps with limited flat land/lots of high hammer cities so the opportunity cost isn't that high and the relative value of the gold is, well, higher...I'd say 20+ cities with the religion would be the base line I'd look to before I even considered the option. I would say that "niche" is a much better description of the wonder, rather than "shit".

[Commodore]

Home, home on the range...
where the cottages begin to cover the plains.
Where seldom is heard,
an encouraging word,
and the workers all feel hunger pangs...


Eddie up there is finally working on its courthouse; we're very very near getting the forbidden palace, which is a frickin huge deal. As for the making of the beast itself; I'm going to donate two forests for the courthouse here in Victoria, getting 60->75h into it, so bringing it into easy whipping range. Then the other four go for 120->150h into the palace, so an easy five turns working deer and the copper mine should get her done. This, needless to say, should be a good 40gpt *already*, more as I keep expanding.


Banks just got itself into easy whippin' range. It can take its time on the making of the thing, nominally, but -9.87gpt already means earlier courthouses ain't problematic. But, I also like to grow this sucker. So we'll see. In other news, unworked riverside silver mines make me cry but...I gotta.


Premature as this all seems, the next phase of Operation Dotmap Justice is coming. I'll start chopping this turn where the worker/settler stand, the next turn I'll settle Somerset, chop walls in, dump in a crossbow or longbow, and move in a trireme to upgrade to a carrack. The vulnerable window won't be at all this way (his slow-movers can't make it in time before the walls come in). Then we start playing this smart, naval-wise. No more of this land posturing. The elephants don't actually matter, except for focusing the mind wonderfully. I'm getting several chariots moving over this direction to upgrade into knights for finally removing this abomination against all dotmaps.

[Commodore]

By the way, after Optics, I'm going straight Guilds->Banking. Cheap Financial banks will make my oddball upgrade path much more efficient.

Then Education->Economics->Gunpowder, unless I need the muskets sooner. After that I'm a lot more open but I think I'll head for Democracy, getting Nationalism with a double-prereq because Divine Right is the ghetto tech that the monk economy nevertheless needs.

[Zed-F]

What's your intentions toward the Operatic empire after you are done isolating and evicting them from Greenerland?

[Commodore]

What's your intentions toward the Operatic empire after you are done isolating and evicting them from Greenerland?

Viking spy! Be gone!

Honestly, it's "depends". Ichabod's actions will determine Willie's vulnerability. My only must have is all the arctic.