RB Pitboss #2 [SPOILERS] - Peter of Byzantium

[regoarrarr]

Okay I did a few ponderings on the settler path, and using this pic



as a reference, although it was taken on T37, which I think was 2? turns ago.

I think we don't need to road down any more - it won't speed the settler up that much.

T0 - Settler built. 2 warriors on the incense and the plains river tile 2SE of the incense. Settler moves to the incense, assuming no barbs.

T1 - assuming no barbs near the plains river warrior, settler moves there. Warrior moves 1S or 1SE

T2 - Warrior and settler move to the city site, 1N of gold.

That could be T42, 43, 44. It seems that we would want to use our 1st worker to improve Paris (2nd city) while getting a 2nd worker out soon. Obviously dependent on whether or not we have copper

[regoarrarr]

Reply back from athlete

Hey Regoarrarr,

Thanks for the e-mail. When I logged in this morning I noticed your warrior and shortly after moved mine to find your borders . I'll have a more formal response tonight but I just wanted to let you know our team e-mail is [redacted - sunrise or darrell let me know if you want it]. Since I new we had met I had been checking that one, not even thinking to check this until now . Unfortunately work is quite busy today, (tomorrow should be slower) so this will have to be it for my repsonse until tonight. Thanks again for the e-mail and I'll talk to you soon,

Athlete

which happened no more than 5-10 minutes after I realized I also had an email address for Kalin, so I sent one to him too.

My reply to their team email

No problem guys. It was weird - I got this reply no more than like 10 minutes after I realized I also had an email address for Kalin and sent him a brief chaser.

Athlete - to keep you updated, I told Kalin that I believed your warrior was on a silk tile south of a lake next to a peak, and said that it would be nice if you would take the southern route around that peak (move SW next turn instead of NW). Like I said to him, it's not a huge deal if you feel you have to move NW next to our borders, but we would prefer the southern route.

As an incentive, we have met another civ - Jowy of the Greeks. They are located due west of your warrior's current position, so if you head due west you should run into them before too long.

Hope to hear from you soon

[regoarrarr]

More diplomacy coming in - this time from Jowy

We are willing to sign a NAP between our two civs. Was it 100 turns from now, or to Turn 100 that you suggested the NAP? Well, regardless, we would like to propose that our No-Attacking-Pact will be TO turn 100. We can of course renew this NAP at that point. I would like to suggest an additional rule that neither side can make a clearly passive-aggressive move against the other, like aggressive settling on the other's lands or helping someone else to war against the other.

Let me know if Byzantine agrees on this deal. We are looking forwards to your response, and hope that regardless of the outcome our teams can work together for benefit of both sides and settle any disputes with a pen not a sword. Considering the number of teams in the game, it should be good thing to have a friend or two instead of being left out of the loop.

I think we should try to settle some sort of border agreement with them. Here's my thoughts on how we should handle the teams we've met diplomatically

Jowy - long NAP - possible border agreement to ensure that we get a "fair" shake of land to our south and west

IKZ - allies - they should have 2 civ's worth of lands to expand into, so we'll use that to try and get some good land between us (and they're not that close to us anyways)

athlete - cataphracted! aggressive settlement(s) towards them, but also 100 turn nap or so to ensure that we're safe till Guilds

[darrelljs]

am I correct that we are not revolting to slavery nor whipping the settler?

I think if we need to settle west to get the Copper we should whip. Let's see though. They were wise to secure some kind of "fair land settlement" arrangement prior to agreeing to the NAP, if we do settle east then that actually helps us as we can backfill later . After BW comes in we can reply depending on Copper location(s).

I think the road to Paris is important for logistical reasons, but not as important as getting the Gold and Deer online. Let's at least road Incense down diagonally to the river so we get the cities connected and the 2C from trade though.

Let's push hard with Athlete to get a NAP in place since once we settle the jig is up.

Darrell

P.S. I wonder if sunrise realized he needed to check the forums every 10 minutes or so when we put the team together ?

[darrelljs]

Okay, so I did a few sims.

First off we can certainly road to the river and only lose one Worker turn on getting the Gold up and running. We do NOT need to speed Meditation up, we want to research it 2160 B.C. after we've founded our second city.

Second, if we go straight to Priesthood->Pottery, AND we build Worker then whip Worker at the capital, we can whip The Oracle on turn 62, completing it on turn 63 to take Metal Casting. This has obvious implications to our defense. Paris will get the Gold and Deer online quickly with our first Worker but basically we'll be relying on Warriors from Paris plus our initial three for defense. Still might be worth it .

If we decide to go for this after seeing Copper location(s), then I will post detailed moves.

Darrell

[regoarrarr]

Okay turn played, BW is in, and do we have copper....



Sort of.

So options are, settle Paris 1W (or 1NW or a couple of other places), picking up copper and missing the deer, or do we count on the fact that Paris will be (relatively) fast to 100 culture to pick up the copper (which is riverside and won't need a road)

Or we can settle even closer, like 1E of the copper - it's too bad there are no hills over there to settle on.

We can also scout for better places to settle but at the cost of turns.

Spiros to the west has moved this turn (he's in the far left of the picture and hopefully will survive a lion this turn). My plan for him was NE-E-NE onto the hill, but I could move him more easterly.

The eastern warrior has not moved this turn, nor has the worker or the warrior near our lands.

As you can see, athlete's warrior is 1SW of our wheat.

So, thoughts....?

[regoarrarr]

And a note from Athlete of the Ottomans

I will mainly be the voice for the Ottoman's. Kalin is currently away and unavailable for several more days so for now it is just me. Let me first say I did move Dice to the NW. However if you feel any unrest about that please do not. He will move SW next turn and further from you as the years pass in hopes to meet the mighty Greek. If you are still unsettled I would be happy to sign an immediate 10 turn NAP with no renewal or anything to pass that away. In regards to your initial proposal it sounds favourable to me but to properly agree to it I would want to consult with Kalin first.
We have currently met only the Incan's prior to yourself and yes they are approximately 10 tiles to our south. They told us that the ruined Zulu civ is to their SW which we have a scout on the way there and that prior to exterminating them, the Zulu revealed they had also met Rome. Make of that what you will.

[regoarrarr]

Reply to athlete

Don't worry I will not be posting your secrets :-) I generally do try to keep people's "code names" out of my spoiler thread.

As for Dice, that's disappointing but not the end of the world.

We remain interested in working with you and hope to hear back from you shortly with thoughts on our initial proposal

[regoarrarr]

A little demographic analysis on Athlete. He is in Slavery, so has BW and can see copper. His warrior has come from that kind of direction, so I would not be surprised if he is aiming his 1st settler that direction. Remember too that he is financial, so that massive grassland river valley is extra attractive for him.

Okay so on CivStats, because I haven't been keeping up with everyone's score changes, it only goes back to T29.

T29 he was at a score of 79
T30 they double whipped and dropped to 73 (from pop 4->2 apparently)
T32 another whip from 2->1 - score dropped to 70
T37 back to a score of 73 - growth from 1->2
T38 score of 79 - tech researched.
T39, current turn, still at a score of 79.

So, with no granary, growing to size 4 requires 22+24+26+28 or 100 food. Reasonable to reach that in 29 turns. Remember our earlier information said that he went warrior first. And it is certainly possible that one of those whips was a granary since he starts with Ag / Wheel. The other obvious whip on T30 is a worker but it seems really late to get your first worker. Maybe they're coastal and went workboat.

Still, it seems unlikely that they have a settler out, unless THAT is what they whipped on T30, in which case it would have settled already. If they are indeed at size 2, they're not going to have a settler out, even whipped, till T44 or 45, at which point we'll have settled.

[regoarrarr]

More demographic analysis, and please let me know if I am threadspamming at all. Sometimes I worry that if I post too much, some of the important posts (like where to settle with the pic that I posted first this morning) get lost.

Anyways, average population is 26000, so total population is 8*26000 or 208000

From top cities we have 2 size 4, 2 size 3 and the worst population from demogs is size 2. So that's 144000, so for the 3 remaining civs we have 64000, which means that there are 3 cities with size 3, and a 2nd city!

Let's check Civ Stats, that's recent enough we should be able to get info on that. Hmm I can't find anything. I'd expect to see a score increase in the middle of a turn, but don't see anything. Anyone want to check my math?

2 size 4 cities is 96000
5 size 3 cities is 105000
1 size 2 city is 6000
total is 207000, divided by 8 is 25875, but avg population is 26000. Plus max food is up to 16 and max prod is up to 9, which leans towards 2 cities in a civ.