Politics Discussion Thread (Heated Arguing Warning)

[AdrienIer]

Maybe Jkaen is talking about the petition for a second referendum "if the vote is under 60% on a turnout less than 75%" ?

[T-hawk]

Everytime I hear someone say "I vote for xy to teach the gov a lesson"

Get used to it, because that's exactly what's going to put Donald Trump in charge of the USA in five months.

Of course, the one EU country that won't be departing is Remainia.

How is the EU like a full hard drive? They both have no GB remaining.

[Commodore]

I voted to stay in, but a lot of people fell for the arguments of leave, the main weird one being to ignore experts as they dont know anything (with almost everybody saying leave would hurt the economy)

Did they fall for the arguments, or did they react against the visceral hatred the experts had for them? You can be correct on all the facts but if someone senses you hold him in utter contempt good luck swaying him.

The massive panning of democracy and universal suffrage I keep reading about as a reaction to these populist revolts warms the dark cockles of my reactionary heart.

[Rowain]

Everytime I hear someone say "I vote for xy to teach the gov a lesson"

Get used to it....

Won't happen. Heared that idiocity so often alread still think any idiot using this reason for vote should get a public whipping.

How is the EU like a full hard drive? They both have no GB remaining.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

I voted leave. Most important vote in a generation. Went campaigning for it and everything, spent hours and hours pounding the streets to make sure that we left the EU. Not all of us are the great unwashed and old the media would have you believe! I think I am relatively young and well off :P

[Mardoc]

Now that the UK's main international influence is gone what need does the US have for it?

Pretty sure that 'need' doesn't describe our foreign policy. When's the last time you heard someone say the US is too focused on realpolitik, not idealistic enough?

[The Black Sword]

I voted leave.

I'm curious to your reasons if you're not worn out campaigning them?

I didn't pay it much attention because I assumed you'd vote stay.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

I voted leave.

I'm curious to your reasons if you're not worn out campaigning them?

I didn't pay it much attention because I assumed you'd vote stay.

It's fine, I had waited years for this vote. Lots of people struggle to understand them.

Basically, the EU is teetering on disaster. The way it needs to move with integrated budgets, fiscal transfers and further integration is completely at odds with what would serve the UK best from the relationship. Either it stays as it is and the eurozone starts to loose weaker members like Greece who desperately need either a cash injection or to devalue their currency, or we integrate and the non euro countries get shafted. Status quo just isn't an option in this question. There is a veto on big things like countries joining the EU, but smaller deals use qualified majority voting which the eurozone countries have. This would sleepwalk the UK into a federal Europe it doesn't want. I expect there to be a fiscal shock like there is currently, but the sooner it is done the better. No part of the EU would actually refuse to trade with us, be it the german auto industry, the french car makers or the irish who send huge chunks of their trade to us. Indeed if the EU tries to slap on tariffs, this is more likely to cause contagion than anything else IMO re ireland.

Then I vehemently dislike the free movement of people. There is a crisis of housing/health/schools that is impossible to plan for if you have no idea who is coming into the country. Plus our non EU immigration is rather restrictive, due to the uncontrolled EU immigration. If we were to lower EU immigration then we could relax non EU, and be able to admit more skilled workers than we do currently. The free movement of people not only pushes wages down on the lowest paid, it also pulls money out of the social security system.

Thirdly is an issue of sovereignty. I dislike the idea of an EU court having say over UK courts, and also with parliaments. The prisoner votes issue is the classic example of this.

Then of course there is the cost. We pay in 350million a week, and after returns this equates to costing us near 200 million to be part of the club.

I want no trade barriers, but the price the politicians want for their Euro project is just too high. We haven't even got into the actual leaders that Brussels manages to elect (Juncker - if they vote to leave we will make them pay, like seriously instead of finding the best outcome for the 2 countries?!) or stupid rules (the 2nd chamber in Strasbourg) and of course trade deals having to be oked by all 28 member countries. It is a mess.

[Jowy]

I feel like working together and making Europe a better place to live for all of us would in the long term benefit all European countries. Is that too naive?

[ipecac]

I feel like working together and making Europe a better place to live for all of us would in the long term benefit all European countries. Is that too naive?

No. The first step involves getting rid of the Brussels bureaucracy. Together, you can do it!

On a slightly more serious note, how's Greece doing?