[PB36 Spoilers] GermanJoey's Meltdown Betting Pool

[GermanJoey]

oh is it just 90 GPP here? goddamn, man I really need to run some damn sims, gotta try to make some time for it tonight, at least an hour or two.

Re: Monty - you don't actually need the GS for Chemistry for the Musketeers themselves, it's just the most sensible next-tech by far unless the need for Galleons is extremely pressing. As far as a bulb for Machinery... it's just the question as to whether it's faster to bulb it or tech it, and I was thinking that bulbing it might be better since we'd want to be spamming workshops rather than cottages. IDK though, could be something to figure out later. For sure the Eng is the lynchpin in the whole plan, and getting it second, after the Philo bulb, makes the most sense to me too. One Eng w/ Paci for 30 turns isn't too bad, I suppose. If the GE is 2nd, then the GM is 3rd, so I don't think the GM could go into CS as that'd be too slow for that tech - it would have to go into Guilds I think. Engineering would be slow-teched (theoretically to completion to coincide with the Guilds bulb) and then the GE nabs gunpowder. The GM could come as soon as 4-5 turns after the GE is born because of Caste, so the GE could actually be started relatively late, around T25-T30 or whatever.

[Krill]

Check civ4eras.xml

[Krill]

Here's the thing, you can do all that with mansa and it's a trade of agg plus musketeers for Fin. Or with Asoka. It's a viable tech path to get to cannon for anyone. Monty is just the all in version of it in this game. Might be best with Gandhi but fuck that.

PHI leaders want to bulb edu for that OU tastiness. Fin obviously synergises with a beeline to PP and then tries to snowball into a ren era tech lead, but more likely has to catch up with phi bulbs. Org just sits there. Then you choose spi or imp, and in this game spi>imp. Everything else is a fallback pick.

[Krill]

GM takes paper before guilds so you can't get anything but cs with it. Don't fall into the trap asm did in last game focusing on a decent goal and lose sight of immediate concerns.

[mackoti]

very interisting debate here, this shows how great civ4 is.For example i would put Justinian and asoka as top choises for a certain strategy, and Roos vel for other type of strategy.

[Krill]

I think the debate here is coloured by the fixed civ choices. I can see Justinian being strong but then there are also weaknesses to him with lack of building bonuses, no phi fin or org. He seems to be more of a rush leader her, also imp does get weaker when the settlers aren't quite so expensive. Asoka just has no civ in this game, Asoka of Aztecs or hre would be legit. Mansa and Gandhi probably work as well as either of the others. What with the ability to time pp and edu to land at a point when their economies can manage what those techs bring.

I would be worried about taking Roosevelt as it's an all or nothing leader pick. The pay off might be big but it's possible for screw up Ind in these games when a faster starting player steals a wonder out from underneath you.

[GermanJoey]

thanks mack.

i was thinking a little more about Justinian, and he's actually really similar to the Monty/France pick. both of them give superior two-movers (compared to baseline knights) at some sort of economic cost.

5XP Agg Musketeer
pros: Draftable (although with this rush plan), can take Cover, receives defensive bonuses, 10h cheaper, doesn't need a stables
cons: baseline strength weaker, requires Theology for Theocracy, plus Engineering and an Engineer bulb, not immune to first strikes, can't queue-upgrade

11XP Ger Knight:
pros: extra promo
cons: requires Theology for Theocracy, as well as Vassalage (the civic)

Justinian saves about ~50h per settler, Monty saves 90h per city

[GermanJoey]

sending in:

1.) Gandhi of China
2.) Mansa of Arabia
3.) Rosey the Rosevelter of the Dutch
4.) Montezuma of France
5.) Hammurabi of the Holy Roman Empire
6.) Justinian of Mongolia

[Krill]

Stating for posterity: I agree with that pick order.

[mackoti]

thanks mack.

i was thinking a little more about Justinian, and he's actually really similar to the Monty/France pick. both of them give superior two-movers (compared to baseline knights) at some sort of economic cost.

5XP Agg Musketeer
pros: Draftable (although with this rush plan), can take Cover, receives defensive bonuses, 10h cheaper, doesn't need a stables
cons: baseline strength weaker, requires Theology for Theocracy, plus Engineering and an Engineer bulb, not immune to first strikes, can't queue-upgrade

11XP Ger Knight:
pros: extra promo
cons: requires Theology for Theocracy, as well as Vassalage (the civic)

Justinian saves about ~50h per settler, Monty saves 90h per city

The big diference is that you get those 50 at the beggining a game so you can have a city more after 15-18 turns then the civs without Imperialist.While using AGG use is very late, and if you need to use at the begginig mean you are under atack or atcking someone early so you are in danger which means you are doing bad already.