Oldies - Old Games We Might Have Missed

[RFS-81]

This is one of those threads where everybody is just reciting their favorites and nobody's really going to play anything based on the recommendations, but here's my several cents anyway. Mostly I'll cover areas and genres that haven't come up already.

I haven't bought anything yet, but I replayed Thief again because of this thread, does that count for something?

I actually got that one when it was new, but I was way too young. The first level was scary enough, but the zombies in the second were end of the line for me. I went back to it several times and got the GOG version after losing my disc. If you're thinking about buying it and don't want it on Steam, the GOG version is working out of the box for me!

Other than that there is a rather large list of classic games/series I expect everyone to have played already, such as Diablo, Deus Ex, Half-Life, Planescape: Torment, Pirates, Starcraft & Warcraft games, System Shock, Dungeon Keeper, Baldur's Gate, Command & Conquer, Duke Nukem 3D...
I still think these games were great back in the day, but with limited time for gaming and really cheap prices through online sales, I don't think I would spend a lot of time on those older games today, especially when there has been a comeback of certain genres, i.e. RPGs. Sure, it might be interesting to play Baldur's Gate, but you could also spend your time playing Divinity 2.

Then again, it might depend on age, but at least for me many games I found spectacular when they came out, don't hold up very well when revisited in 2018. Sometimes it's better to let them rest in peace, but your mileage may vary.

Yes, many games that were good for their time or did something new and interesting have been surpassed by later games. And with all the nostalgia, it's hard to pick out which ones really hold up. I replayed Baldur's Gate a few years ago, and coming from Dragon Age: Origins...well, the first thing that annoyed me was the slow movement speed. Then you have the problems that come from the D&D ruleset it was using. Extremely random combat - did it really ever sound like a good idea to have most attacks miss, but a single hit can easily kill a 1st level mage? Spells that either do nothing, or have devastating effects, depending on the other side's saving throw?

On the other hand, there are some things that simply aren't done anymore. I don't think there'll be a modern game similar to Morrowind, for example. It's too big for indies, and AAA developers will go for a more generic fantasy world. Minimalist 4X games like MOO1 are thin on the ground, and I can't think of any recent one except Dominus Galaxia (currently in beta).

Speaking of things that aren't done anymore...

Realms of Arkania: This is an old RPG trilogy that I can't recommend wholeheartedly, but I think some people might find it interesting. It's based on a German pen-and-paper rpg called "Das Schwarze Auge" (The Dark Eye). Inside dungeons, it's a pretty standard 1st person party-based dungeon crawler. The only slightly novel thing here is that it switches to an isometric map for (turn-based) combat. Outside of dungeons it almost turns into a kind of management sim. For travelling, you have to buy weather-appropriate equipment. When you make camp, you assign characters for guard shifts, collecting herbs, hunting, or treating illnesses and injuries. In towns, you can earn money by playing music in taverns. I'd love to see a more modern take on this, but I guess you can see why it's lacking mass appeal

I usually don't like it if you have to buy rations in RPGs. It's just a constant sink of money that you can't do anything about. But RoA allows you to skimp on rations, if one of your characters is skilled at hunting, which makes the whole thing more interesting for me.

The story isn't particularly inspired. The orc armies are marching, and the only way to drive them back is the MacGuffin! But hey, it works well enough. The first game is very non-linear. You're just exploring different places, trying to find enough pieces of a map that will lead you to the Blade of Destiny™. There are some things that are really grating, though, besides the expected old-gamey clunkyness. Some spells and skills are very nearly useless. There's one called something like Banish Ghosts, which can be used in only two places in the entire trilogy

one of which is in a room in a side dungeon in the 2nd game, which you can't leave until you successfully cast it

which might well be literally impossible, depending on your party composition and level-up choices

Class-balancing isn't great. Elves* are naturally skilled at hunting, archery and music, and can also cast spells, so why would you ever pick, e.g., a hunter. Also, it's pretty much impossible to calculate in your head how likely it is that you succeed at skill checks, so you don't really know which skill rank is "good". That's a problem the DSA ruleset had since it introduced its skill system. At least you have the computer to deal with all the dicerolls and arithmetic that go into a single stupid skill check!

The games are available on GOG and also on Steam. I can't vouch for the English translation. There are 3d remakes that are only on Steam, which I haven't played yet. As far as I can tell, it offers better graphics and UI, but leaves the game rules intact, which in this case is a big minus IMO.

*Yes, Elf is a class. The edition of DSA it's based on didn't distinguish races and classes, just like very-old D&D.

[Herman Gigglethorpe]

I don't see many new games like Uncharted Waters:  New Horizons.  The closest comparison I can make is Sid Meier's Pirates.  Ship combat is turn-based on a grid, and you either fire cannons at the enemy, have your crew fight it out at close range, or duel the captain.  Sailing is more "arcade" than Pirates, so all the wind does is make you faster or slower. 

The whole world (or at least the regions bordering rivers and oceans) is available for trade or plunder, and the time period is the 1520s. Not a historically accurate 1520s, mind you; one of the "discovery" events involves a pterodactyl killing your crew.  This game doesn't take itself too seriously.

[RFS-81]

I'll turn this thread on its head and ask for a recommendation instead.

I like space sims like Privateer, Freelancer and Dark Star, but the trading part gets boring because you can't do anything more than being a space trucker. So the X series (or Eve Online, in case I lose my job) is what I'm looking for, right? Which one of those is the best? Any other recommendations?

[Hail]

I'll turn this thread on its head and ask for a recommendation instead.

I like space sims like Privateer, Freelancer and Dark Star, but the trading part gets boring because you can't do anything more than being a space trucker. So the X series (or Eve Online, in case I lose my job) is what I'm looking for, right? Which one of those is the best? Any other recommendations?

EVE Online I cannot recommend - I wanted to get back, but read the forums that the game is stagnating and online is falling, so meh. Stil waiting for the T3 BS that were promised year(s) ago.

May I recommend Space Rangers 2 - a space sim with a top-down view. trade, complete missions (some missions are straight-forward, but others require you to complete a text quest ), fight, raid transport ships, etc. all weapon systems have eight tiers, while other modules have eight levels that are available later in the game (how much later is configurable). ship chassis differ by open (a module can be fit into) slots and tier (determines ship armor).

[RFS-81]

I actually bought Space Rangers 2 on GOG long ago! IIRC, I didn't like the combat much. But I'm just installing it now, to give it a try again! Also, the game has gotten a remake in the meantime, which I apparently got for free because I had the old one. Nice!

By the way, the zombies in Thief are still scary. The wheezing sounds they make while roaming are worse than the stereotypical zombie sounds when they chase you!

[Bacchus]

I enjoyed the original space rangers a lot when they came out, and actually a similar vibe to the 'Explore the Carribean' series. In the same line, Escape Velocity was a great series of games, no idea how they aged.

[Hail]

I actually bought Space Rangers 2 on GOG long ago! IIRC, I didn't like the combat much.

the combat is nothing spectacular, it's simple and the outcome is completely determined by your outfit - your dps is enough to kill things before they kill you or not enough... keep in mind weapon ranges, though. but the game is not about combat.

[RFS-81]

I actually bought Space Rangers 2 on GOG long ago! IIRC, I didn't like the combat much.

the combat is nothing spectacular, it's simple and the outcome is completely determined by your outfit - your dps is enough to kill things before they kill you or not enough... keep in mind weapon ranges, though. but the game is not about combat.

If it's not about combat, then why is it making me do this damned endless tutorial fight? It seems that to hit the drone I need to know where it'll be several turns in the future. I picked a merchant ship, if that matters, but I think it should be possible to at least solve the tutorial with any of the ships.

The music rocks though!

[rho21]

By the way, the zombies in Thief are still scary. The wheezing sounds they make while roaming are worse than the stereotypical zombie sounds when they chase you!

Join usssss. Join us now!

[Hail]

If it's not about combat, then why is it making me do this damned endless tutorial fight? It seems that to hit the drone I need to know where it'll be several turns in the future. I picked a merchant ship, if that matters, but I think it should be possible to at least solve the tutorial with any of the ships.

to hit ships, your ship must be within weapon range of your weapons (look at what you have equipped in your weapon slots). obviously, if the enemy can outrun you, then you will have trouble hitting it. rockets and torpedoes have giant ranges (especially torps), but the projectiles can be aimed at and shot down. the damage delt depends on the difference between your attack skill, their maneuver skill, target ship's field generator and ship's armor. any non-zero damage causes internal module damage.

your velocity depends on the engine tier, its modification(s), ship mass (the more max. volume and filled volume the ship has, the more the mass), medical injections, and artifacts. activated booster (the little button on the upper-left side of the ship "ragdoll") doubles velocity.

a standart merchant ship has a large max. volume and lacks the booster - so you will not be able to escape from pirates and generally be slow, which in this game is a no-no, since all missions and simulated events are timed. even modules you find through the search will not be on sale forever.

and skip the tuturial. I always skip it.

The music rocks though!

the music is awesome, among the best.