[PB 55] Miguelito and Mjmd help Amicalola avoid a repetition of last time

[Miguelito]

Weren't we in this war to save superdeath and split Lewynn with him somehow? I that not a goal anymore / not achievable? If we take peace, will Lewynn take over SD and then eat us? In that case even cold war might be preferable.
Basically, is there anything you want to do during the next ten turns that you can afford only if there is no fighting during that time? (but possibly afterwards!)

civac/Jowy I really feel like I can't judge those options, but keep in mind that you'll have to guard the Lewynn border either way.

[Amicalola]

Thanks for the responses guys, super helpful

Right now, I’m still quite worried that fully splitting Lewwyn will not be viable, as he seems to just be producing units everywhere, and they are good units too. SD is a great distraction but I think he’s unable to do much conquering himself. In fact, peace with Lewwyn right now may lead to exactly my first fear anyway; him killing SD fully with all the new troops.

We should have control of that 1N fish tile for quite a while, at least 15 turns I think.


Perhaps a middle ground approach is best? We could try to take Moai as it is an absurd city and would definitely end his chances of winning, and then sue for peace and launch our GA? Big risks of that plan include:

- can’t take Moai if it is too well defended. Need 6 ish galleys at least.
- he doesn’t take peace after we capture Moai because he recognises his game is over and just wants to ruin ours too. Would be an entirely understandable reaction imo, though I’m not sure how prone Lewwyn is to spiteful actions. Lurker input?

Plus then if we’re still feeling good after (if?) taking Moai, we could just keep pushing too. The GA could then be used after we split Lewwyn, optimistically. I just agree that we can’t really do anything vs Covac or Jowy right now, and leaving Lewwyn that Moai city and all his power means SD could still easily die to him.

[Amicalola]

Hang on, what the fuck am I talking about?

I was thinking about what you said Miguelito about things we can do in the 10 turn grace period of peace. There are two very good reasons to sign peace for the next 10 turns, and then kill him.

1) Forges. This gives us time to build them nearly everywhere that wants to, which is nearly everywhere itself.
2) Pikeman. This gives us time to make quite a few, and they will be very nice vs BEs.
2.5) Using our GA soon to convert to vassalage as we gear up for round 2 of the war. Not a full reason because I'm not sure it's the best use of a GA, but it could be good. We could also swap into our religion and also OR at the same time so that after the war we can whip a bunch of infra. Thoughts?

Either way, I think reasons 1 and 2 even without 2.5 are good enough reasons to take peace, so I think I will do that.

Although, now that I think about it, do pikemen work against BEs if they can attack mounted units first? Including our elephants. Might mean we need no WEs in a stack that also has pikes. But pikes are great and we want them soon.

Edit: Huh, just learned that closing the game with a diplo offer open is the same as rejecting it. Sent him the peace offer back, we'll see if he accepts.

[Mjmd]

For some reason I thought BEs lost that text in the mod and were just 8 str. I am very wrong. No wonder they have been picked every CtH game!

[Amicalola]

Alright, turn has been played under the assumption that he will accept the peace treaty (I see no real reason he wouldn't, since he sent it already). Forges being built almost literally everywhere, will be whipped to completion soon. Is there any type of city (other than low food islands with no whipping or natural production) that I shouldn't build a forge in ASAP? I can change those next turn.

Sorry, there will be a proper domestic overview when I'm back in Melbourne. I just can't take pictures here so it would be a bit pointless.

And yeah, BEs are nuts, man. Nuts... There a large part of the reason I thought building up for 10-15 more turns was better, especially since now Lewwyn can't kill SD (hopefully). I imagine Lewwyn will in the next 10 turns try to prove me wrong and blitz through SD's territory, making me look like a big fool. If he can do that, we need to blitz him just as hard after the peace period is up, before he has time to act on those gains. Hopefully my initial assessment that SD has built up a large army, and that Lewwyn is a bit too checked out to care, is correct. But he did send the treaty for a reason....

[Mjmd]

Mjmd's guide to forges. This has not been run by smarter people.
Cities that are at or commonly switch tiles to be at 8 production.
Cities that have HIGH food pops and are whipped every 10 turns.

[Mjmd]

NEED MORE PICTURES. So did it myself! Was too awake.


Added some signs.
-Didn't we talk about making Irish Coffee a production city? You could make it a kind of meh mixed city.
-Assuming the chop taking place near capital is going into one of the filler city settlers.
-Why does Whiskey Sour have the shared sheep? It doesn't have any tiles to work really btw. You have workers improving tiles for cities you haven't settled yet, but this poor city still got nothing.
-I next turned your scout in Jowy lands so you would move it
-Also why chariot coming back from Civac lands?

You did not whip enough for your war. This power graph line should have been way more vertical.

[Amicalola]

Hi, thanks for doing that. I've had a lot less time with the holiday season.

points in order:
- Now that you mention it, I think we did. I think we were planning to have it work cottages for Aperol when necessary, but I mixed that up in my head as being a mixed city. Farm there makes sense, I agree it is a much better production city. Fog brain.

- Yep, chop is going into a settler next turn.

- Whiskey Sour mostly has the shared sheep because I want to grow it up a little bit. I have been working the coast tiles because the plains cottages seem sad, but maybe I should cottage them soon and start working them. Worth noting we would need to keep the sheep for a while (~15 turns? 10?) to make that work. But while it doesn't have those cottages, you're right it probably should have given the sheep to one of the bigger cities.

- Not moving the scout in jowy lands was very silly. A big auto-pilot choice I subconsciously made a while ago. Whoops. Thanks for reminding me.

- Hmm, I already felt like I was damaging the empire severely with the little whipping I did. Maybe that's just the cost of war and I should have accepted it? Next round, I will whip far more in preparation. 

- I was bringing back that chariot as a medic. That's stupid, because I plan to cancel the horse deal in a couple of turns to make some promo-chariots at Espresso. Another stupid autopilot move. Posting and talking about it is the best way to realise that. I should probably be posting more, huh?

But seriously, thanks for this. I needed a bit of a kick to get out of mental slump/stagnation. I am still busy for the next two weeks, but I'll try not to neglect reporting further. You've mentioned not sleeping a few times. I hope it gets better soon, I went through a period of insomnia a few years ago and they were easily the worst months of my life. But professionals or even just online tips can do wonders. Alternatively if it is kids, you'll know more than I do, but I hear that will get better. Sometime in the next 1-6 years.

[Miguelito]

Do you have Whiskey Sour marked as a production city, or hybrid? I'd see the former, but I can see how it generates some commerce with FIN coast if it's the latter. Still would not cottage there. Besides the winery and horses, two plains watermills really should eat up all the food, and help you much quicker. Might also windmill the shared green hill, but not sure if you wantto take a mine away from the cap.

[Mjmd]

Problem with financial is everything starts to look like a mixed city / hybrid.

I feel like whipping for an offensive war is always really hard. The important thing to remember is that your opponent will whip to the ground to defend. You therefore have to have more production (usually this early via whip) or a tech advantage. I actually really like no score mod btw Mig; that was a good suggestion. It helps hide the power spike for a couple of turns.

It is 100% the kids. What happens is baby wakes up waking me up. Causes me to be tired the next day. I then take a nap to compensate. I then am not as tired when I SHOULD be going to bed. Baby then wakes me up again. It is just a cycle. My wife doesn't wake up easily, so it is usually me getting the baby at night. Like last night. Went to bed at 2am. Woke up two times. Up at 7:30 am. Will I take a nap today. You bet! Main problem is probably I take too long of naps. Scientifically 20-30 minute naps are supposed to be the best.