[SPOILERS] Kaiser and TheArchduke are nice and friendly neighbours

[TheArchduke]

I am currently researching astrology on the way to Writing.

Do you have time this evening or tomorrow to plan?

[Kaiser]

Tonight not, but tomorrow yes. I was busy this weekend but I wanted to check some map options for perspective. I have the feeling the map is intentionally bleak so there is a bigger difference between low builder/quick military and high builder/defense.

[TheArchduke]

Turn 13

Looking better, 2 new city sites.

   

[Kaiser]

You are right thrawn, the city to the N is a waste to settle (before the volcano erupts and it remains bad even after) I was just occupying myself there a bit :D

We both have a heavy investment ahead of us due to the need of Masonry to open up key district locations (HS for me, Campus for TAD).
So let us look at our options:
- Japan
Builder1: Quick HS into HS at 2nd city and then hopefully 1st or 2nd religion (unlikely due to China already on its way to Astrology and likely no need for Masonry)
Builder2: Campus first (no need for Masonry as forest can already be chopped) into more settlers and delayed HS maybe later
Builder3: Quick Settler#3 for unknown
Military1: Switch to AH -> Sailing for Galleys to scout, as we cannot pillage coastal tiles, it is currently limited to scouting (can be combined with Builder3)
-England: no apparent need for Builders at Capital or 2nd city
Builder1: Campus first (needs Masonry and Builder which is else not needed right away)
Builder2: Quick Settler#3 for the decent looking location in the south
Military1: Switch to AH -> Sailing for Galleys to scout, as we cannot pillage coastal tiles, it is currently limited to scouting (can be combined with Builder3)

TAD and me were discussion just earlier that we are delaying to much to get Sailing and so he switched from Astrology (pre-req for writing) to AH -> sailing. So he is going to delay Writing to get Settler #3 out and some galleys for scouting.
The big question for me is if Japan goes:
- for a similar approach already knowing that at least 1 city location is really bad.
- sticks with the HS plan
- switches to Campus first instead (stop Masonry, go Pottery -> Astrology -> Writing)

In any of these cases, we are hoping to find a natural Wonder on our island quickly (I hope this has been balanced, else this is a 9 turn disadvantage, basically one early tech with boost) for the Astrology Eureka as it is gating Writing and we have no way to speed past it.
Going HS first probably means here taking Goddess of the river to get to 3rd district quickly, however we are already on the backfoot regarding pantheons apparently. Neither TAD nor me see an important other pantheon at the moment, so we are considering going Urban planning.

[Kaiser]

The religion choices, but it looks like we are headinf for a late religion anyway due to China of all Civs finding a natural wonder this early.

In that case I still need to finish masonry for the Eureka for TAD, but it can be delayed until he nears completion of writing, so sailinh could barely fit in there.

I doubt however that we can conquer any city states with Galleys, as I remember seeing some discussion on protected city states like I did in PBEM19 for the island CS.

I expect Galleys to be mostly of scouting and defense value. Even scouting is minimized as Team games have no first to meet boni for CS.

Let me check this

[Kaiser]

There was some talk about protected CS but I am not sure it was finalized that way so it could be either way, conquering CS seems to be a potential option.
I ran a quick test team game and confirmed that there are no first to meet boni for CS. Probably the game cannot decide who met the CS first (even though it did when China found a Natural Wonder)

So let us get our assumptions straight:
- relative empty map (96x60) with large amounts of water and player starting positions nearby
- 8 (instead of 10) players probably roughly equidistantly placed, possible the team members are closer (TAD and me are 14 - 15 tiles apart)
- 16 (instead of 15) CS, possibly protected in a sense, my guess is at least none on our island or at least inaccessible by land
- map has a bleak look on my side, more normal at TAD, so potentially a weak start/decent start setup
- my tile picker is an ass picking the 1 3 crab over the 4 :food GJBanana
- TeamOrange (us) is likely located on the equator (or the map has been tinkered with extensively)
- original goal was a more buildery game, so the map might be set up to present interesting choices regarding Improvements and juggeling of Builder activity

For balancing purposes
- Islands are probably similar sized
- Island and Players are probably similar distant between Teams
- Islands probably offer similar number of comparable quality city spots (I hope our N spot does not count here or else other players are screwed)
- probably similar inspirations/Eurekas available on all islands (continents, Natural Wonders, 3 CS in reach, farmable resources, mineable resource, quarryable resource)
- There will very likely be other islands of unknown size
- the two stone locations could be placed on purpose to force players to invest more in building up and infrastructure, this could indicate that other players face similar challenges regarding district placement or early optimization

I am fine with pushing religion to later, I am already considering pushing pantheon late and running Urban Planning instead as there is no strong pantheon in sight and we could instead be building our first dirstrict or 2nd Settler quicker.
I am also fine with going Sailing instead of TAD, I just need to make sure to finish Masonry in time for him to research it so he can place his Campus district. In any case rushing writing without Masonry does not work for him. Tad will be quicker to Foreign Trade thanks to his Monument and Amber tile, so he will be able to use the 100% Naval production card earlier.
My Campus tile is blocked by forest which I can already chop, so in total I might be quicker to the campus than TAD is to his, lets calculate:
- Japan: needs Mining (done) -> Pottery 25 -> Astrology 50 (30 with Eureka) -> Writing 30 = 80 - 105 science
- England: needs Mining 25 -> Masonry 50 (30 with Eureka) -> Pottery (done) -> Astrology 37.5 (17.5 with Eureka) -> Writing 30 = 102.5 - 142.5

I switch to Pottery in direction of Astrology Writing for the moment, as I do not need Masonry before Astrology and TAD only needs it for Writing

[TheArchduke]

Kaiser, my teamviewer pc at home combo does not work. Please use my token I send per pm to do my turns until the 3rd of january.

I am stuck in the country.

[Kaiser]

Sure, got your token

[Kaiser]

As discussed Urban planning, I checked the calculations again when realizing that mysticism is the next Civic and you would not have gotten your pantheon anyways before finishing it thanks to the coming Monument. Your Monument first start has been a bit screwed by the tech shuffle forcing Mysticism next thus wasting 20 :culture; ~10 turns of Monument worth

The Warrior moved up on the PHJ and the full way for the Settler is now fogbusted. 




Which seems to be pointless as all the barbs are here *gnarg*

Well the Warrior should be able to stop this scout as long as it remains on coast tiles, the question is if we can send the Settler S now or if it has to go blind E.

International news:
Indonesia, Phoenicia and Norway grew recently, either they are not working on a Settler right now or they do not care about the wasted 9 food when producing the Settler a size 3. To get there they worked their 3  tiles longer or got a good 3+  tile by the tile picker, which I doubt as that would be a glaring discrepancy in starting tiles (outside of the GJBanana)

[Kaiser]

the turn came around today, I just played it the barb stepped up on the mountain and the settler showed another scout showing up from the E with his evasive Maneuver. That is tough barb luck.
I switched to a Slinger as we only need the Quarry in ten turns and healed the Warrior to step next turn on the hill in order to cut the way from the S Scout.

Everythings running as planned for TAD, the Settler is on the way.




It looks like my niece is coming tonight, a bit in advance and I just became the chauffeur thanks to an exploded tire, so I cannot go into more details now, I will see when I can update again