[PLAYERS DO NOT ENTER] Lurkers thread, where lurkers are making fun of the players

[Boldly Going Nowhere]

Any ideas as to what happened to Care Bears? It sure seemed like they were in top position early on:
-highest city count
-highest food
-ample luxaries
-Oracled COL
-GE'd the Pyramids

Normally such rapid expansion would mean that the economy was a risk but with representation + courthouses it sure seemed that they wouldn't fall into that trap. I saw that they adopted Police State which I thought was questionable,...

So what happened? Were they just outplayed? Diplo shutout? Score management through intentional whip-down of cities? Or is there some other lesson to learn here?

I just took a quick look at their thread, which is very scarce on reporting. I think they over-expanded and compounded the poor GNP by delaying currency (and wealth builds) much longer than was prudent. MC, masonry, OR and whatever else they researched before going for Currency as an IMP civ was probably a bad idea, but I can't be 100% sure without reading other threads and doing some serious peeking around, which I'm not inclined to do for this game. IMP + Rep specialists would have certainly been better than police state, at a casual glance, so long as they weren't under military pressure. With NAPs available, I doubt they were under much pressure.

[NobleHelium]

Hey guys, sorry I've been so silent recently. Who knew that having a newborn plus a full time job was so much work?

Re: the mess in the tech thread. I'm really unhappy about Raptorous taking over for DMOC. First, I think it is unprecedented at RB for a vanquished team/player to take over a different civ after being eliminated. But that's not a big deal, if a replacement player can't be found that was not already playing in the game, I think this is a creative back-up plan. Second, it's replacing my most reliable, staunchest ally with a player that has called me out publicly for not fulfilling a deal ( which I disagree with, but that's another topic entirely). Most importantly, however, is that we're replacing the player who has the best chance to challenge Suttree for the win, with one of the worst players in this game. I think the implications of this basically means that Suttree will win this game unchallenged. Oh well...

Well, it's definitely ridiculous that DMOC made that post like it was some unobjectionable matter-of-course thing.

[Krill]

Plako, I'd have thought it were fairly clear cut that Bisons has to play first.

[plako]

Peace time. IMO their turn order up to this point is totally irrelevant unless they plan on declaring this turn. I hate the idea that players are trying to have a playing order peace time. I accept is as nescessary evil to get any kind of game, but it really delays the game unnescessarily.

[Krill]

*shrug* Peace timer playing orders generally occur from RL reasons (for example PB15 I would almost always play my turn after novice simply because of time zones). I accept that it might be different here...because Bisons is IIRC from France and UTC+1 and DMOC is UTC-5 or more. That said, I don't actually agree that peace time is relevant, because the only thing stopping war declarations are the NAPs in place, and technically, they are not relevant to double moves as someone could decide on any given turn to declare war anyway. So yes, in this instance, I actually think that peace time turn order does matter.

[plako]

I know there is no right answer to this i.e. these are just how I think these games should be played and keep them enjoyable to all parties. I think none of us enjoys constantly waiting until there are 2h in the clock and then playing. I would really like to see this behavior removed not praised with eternal last to act right when declaring war. I've followed enough these bigger games and almost always there are few players who constantly try to play late despite of their real life playing window. IMO this is unwanted behavior and shouldn't have any effect to war time turn order. NAP makes delaying playing even more harmful. NAP breaking is very unlikely.

[Krill]

Yeah, I completely agree that people who camp the turn need lynching; I might even feel more strongly about you than that.

I feel that NAP completely fuck up the turn camping though. It's completely orthogonal to RB values (which is what I think Suttree was talking about).

[Krill]

there is sure that i need to move after you in fonction of your move, since i see your land. so i cant move before you. you know why.

I don't get this...?

[NobleHelium]

Based upon Krill's response mentioning espionage and those comments, it seems pretty obvious to me that Bisons has either spies or city visibility on DMOC, so he refuses to end his turn until after DMOC plays (despite playing before) so that he can see what DMOC did on DMOC's turn. Which is bullshit.