There are no in-game restrictions to signing peace after declaring on defensive pacts, other than AIs generally refusing to talk to you shortly after a war starting.
(January 31st, 2014, 21:52)Cheater Hater Wrote: Wait, we can actually try for peace without being seen as completely scummy by our other players? If it was an actual (game-enforced) defensive pact, could we sign peace in this position? It seems like our power is higher than our (current ) allies, so we wouldn't be doomed in that respect, though I would want to confirm a long NAP before even thinking about signing peace (which means we would need to get Rome to communicate with us, which seems impossible).
Well, I think a lot of that would depend on how peace was obtained. This is from a group chat (DT receives this chat to their group email, but so far has declined to actively participate, citing their poor English)
Quote:YossarianLives
Do you think we could sue for peace? DMOC
I don't think he will accept peace but maybe we can try YossarianLives
I'll have 15-16 axes, 5 spears, 6-7 cats and a chariot to attack with
I also don't think they would accept
Well, they might accept peace, but they probably wouldn't agree to a NAP
Which makes peace fairly worthless DMOC
i'd love 10 turns of enforced peace. I actually think we could get a macemen in 10 turns if we get peace
once we get maces, that solves all our problems YossarianLives
Yeah, maybe just blockade everywhere and try to get peace... DMOC
Yes. For now I think the best tactic is just not to attack. DT is killing off praets successfully, at least. YossarianLives
Maybe I can reach out to Asterix/Maga to try to broker peace lol
So DMOC seems totally on board with trying to obtain peace if possible. DT are already pretty pissed about DMOC's attack failing, and they'd probably see us as scummy no matter how things turn out at this point.
(January 31st, 2014, 21:55)NobleHelium Wrote: There are no in-game restrictions to signing peace after declaring on defensive pacts, other than AIs generally refusing to talk to you shortly after a war starting.
Unfortunately, we face the exact same restriction with Rome!
So what actually happened? How did we lose this fight? Well, in all our mp war experience and wisdom, DMOC, Teddy and I all failed to consider what might happen if Rome attacked out with their units What ended up happening is that cats were the top defenders against shock praets, which just cut through the cats like butter. At the end of the day, DMOC killed one unit and lost 9, leaving two full-strength shock axes to defend all the injured Roman attackers. The same thing would have happened to us if we attacked, so thank god DMOC went first
I'm still moving units down to maintain our attack schedule in case we decide to continue as planned. On T131, Rome has 4 praets and 4 axes in Arretium. We have 3 axes we can promote to shock to make them top defenders, and then we'll have 7 cats to use in the attack. That means that if Rome does not reinforce the city, and attacks with everything, then they will be able to hit (and probably kill) 5 cats, leaving us with 2 cats and 13 axes to use against them. Seems to me like it is still feasible, but a lot less attractive then before...
We definitely don't want to attack any Roman cities at this point, unless we are going for a kamikaze tactic that is. If we successfully capture and raze Arretium, we have made a true blood enemy in this game, and their armies are likely to come pay us a visit shortly thereafter, just to repay our gest of friendliness.
I just hope Rome will be kept busy in the NE.
As the Americans learned so painfully in Earth's final century, free flow of information is the only safeguard against tyranny. The once-chained people whose leaders at last lose their grip on information flow will soon burst with freedom and vitality, but the free nation gradually constricting its grip on public discourse has begun its rapid slide into despotism. Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master. - Commissioner Pravin Lal, "U.N. Declaration of Rights"
(February 1st, 2014, 17:33)YossarianLives Wrote: So what actually happened? How did we lose this fight? Well, in all our mp war experience and wisdom, DMOC, Teddy and I all failed to consider what might happen if Rome attacked out with their units What ended up happening is that cats were the top defenders against shock praets, which just cut through the cats like butter. At the end of the day, DMOC killed one unit and lost 9, leaving two full-strength shock axes to defend all the injured Roman attackers. The same thing would have happened to us if we attacked, so thank god DMOC went first
Uhm, what? Axes still get a 25% bonus against shock praetorians, I don't see why cats would defend over them.
(February 1st, 2014, 18:39)Old Harry Wrote: Oh yeah... Guess we should have spotted that. Especially given [PB13 spoiler]
Fintourist and I wanted to do exactly that to Suttree's stack of cats and axes a couple of months ago.
If only you'd had defensive terrain (like DMOC could have used!) you'd have been okay.
Goes to show that simming battles way ahead of time is really important...
Yeah, absolutely. I just don't feel I have the time to set up and run sims. It's tough enough just getting the turns played.
(February 1st, 2014, 21:12)Caledorn Wrote: We definitely don't want to attack any Roman cities at this point, unless we are going for a kamikaze tactic that is. If we successfully capture and raze Arretium, we have made a true blood enemy in this game, and their armies are likely to come pay us a visit shortly thereafter, just to repay our gest of friendliness.
I just hope Rome will be kept busy in the NE.
Well, there is some news on this front. Stay tuned...
(February 1st, 2014, 21:33)NobleHelium Wrote: Uhm, what? Axes still get a 25% bonus against shock praetorians, I don't see why cats would defend over them.
No idea. I never anticipated that cats would defend before axes. That is how DMOC explained it to me, though.
(February 2nd, 2014, 00:01)Cheater Hater Wrote: By "we" you mean our alliance, right, and that we haven't actually fought any Roman units, right?
Yeah, I mean the alliance. We have not fought a single battle against Rome.
I'm getting behind on updates, but I'll try to keep things in order.
T131 was busy. DT got a GG and Rome got two in the battle of York (and Antium). Ultimately, York fell (but Antium survived) with heavy losses on all sides. Meanwhile, SuttOxy got their second GM of this Golden Age.
Here's the outcome of the other major battle of the turn, the one that had the greater impact on us. As I mentioned earlier, DMOC lost 9 units to Rome's 1 loss. You can see they decided to settle a city north of the silver, and are retreating their entire stack back to this city.
And here is our front, where we continue to gather our troops together. However, DMOC's crushing defeat means that we probably won't be attacking ourselves down here. I shared the chat with DMOC where we discussed our desire for peace, but our doubt that it is actually attainable...
Quote:Caledorn
We have mail from Rome!
And it's a long explanatory message too! YossarianLives
OMG
That's unbelievable
I really don't believe you. I need to sea it to believe it lol Caledorn
I won't spoil your enjoyment at reading it, so do that at your leisure
So I checked our mail and saw this:
Barteq to DMOC/Teddy and us Wrote:Hi
I wanted to play this game without any diplomacy, but after few debates with Haram and after few last turns, I changed my mind and, at least, will try talk to you, that I could have a clear consciousness after this game.
Short explanation of few things - diplomacy and others:
Most importend reason of my behavior - time, but not only one. First of all, when this game was starting, I lost my main teammate - Haram. He doesn't want to play, cause of the map (too large for him - for me as well, cause at the end I was expecting at least 25% smaller), but I talk to my close friend, Geo, and he agree to my terms (in short and in simplify - I will take 65% of a game and he take a rest). We choose our leader and nations (it was rather entertaining than competiting option on this map for us ). I make few turns and was waiting for him to start playing too, but he was prolonging it. Finally, after many turns, he resign. I was sounding few people in my country, but found no interest, so I make simple decision - no diplomacy and most simple strategy - building large army and than choosing an easiest target :P. I decided to completly cut off diplomacy mostly cause of time reasons - didn't want to play second full time dyplo game (we have our national game in Poland - DT's team members are playing too) and most importend thing - writing in foreign language cost me a lot of time (I don't like to make easy errors, so I often use a dictionary - I understand a lot in english, but I don't use it alone, so I have some troubles with creating correct sentences). I was thinking about resigning too, but it's hard to find a replacement, so I stay (didn't want to destroy a game flow) and start too develop my "brilliant strategy" .
2 things occur, that completly delay me a lot - first - iron - few terrible locations, far away from my initial borders; secend - my laziness - I didn't destroy a warrior only because I would must make a war to destroy it and then try to make peace (and to make peace you need a diplomacy... ). Consequences was easy to predict - you made a contact with DT and form a defensive pact (I didn't know for sure, if it is still active - I get a short message from DT in diplomatic window long time age) and I could do only one thing to deal with it - make a much bigger army :D.
Because I'm playing this game much more for fun, than for a victory (but it doesn't mean, that I will play against my nation and don't use an army when I must), I choose to attack DT team. Why? Cause they had the slightest chances for winning from all of my neighbours. I made this decision after long discussion with Haram - he told me that in simplify - "You rather don't fight for winning, so why spoil a game to a player that played well. I agree with him and attack that's why I attack DT.
Why am I writing now? Answer is easy - first I don't want to spoil your game completly - both of you must keep a bigger army thanks to me (higher costs and lost hammers) and at least give a chance for a peace and second thing, after last turns I felt a blood lust in my vains and I thanks to it found a new will to play (other thing is that in future I want to check one strategy that I never use before in practice).
I don't know, if you want to come to an agreement with me, but if so, than I have 2 easy conditions - carte blanche in England and long term agreement (NAP or even a DP).
PS I shyly admit, that I don't even check this account earlier, so I didn't read any messages hear.
Regards
Barteq leader of GG team
tl:dr - Barteq didn't really want to play this game with these settings, so he set about to play his own non-diplo game to test out an Agg Rome strategy. However, he doesn't want to ruin someone's chances who could actually win the game, which is why he attacked DT and not us or DMOC. He would like to have peace and a NAP with us and DMOC so he can continue his little personal duel against DT.
Caledorn and I both agree this is great news and signing the NAP is what is best for our team. We just need to find out if DMOC will go along, and if so, how to break the news to poor DT
Unfortunately, we face the exact same restriction with Rome!
What ended up happening is that cats were the top defenders against shock praets, which just cut through the cats like butter. At the end of the day, DMOC killed one unit and lost 9, leaving two full-strength shock axes to defend all the injured Roman attackers. The same thing would have happened to us if we attacked, so thank god DMOC went first 
Especially given [PB13 spoiler]
.