[NO PLAYERS] The Kibitzer Klub: PB13 Map & Lurkers

[Ceiliazul]

I think the gifting happened between mackoti and black sword, IIRC

and azza to plako
and lewwyn to azza
and suttree to mackoti
and scooter to azza.

we as lurkers have to own some of this. We could have steered players away from this mess. there was very lite support against it when TBS and Azza did it, the rest of story was written in part by our silence.

[Krill]

Yeah, that bit is true, and scooter makes entirely reasonable points about that.

[darrelljs]

we as lurkers have to own some of this. We could have steered players away from this mess. there was very lite support against it when TBS and Azza did it, the rest of story was written in part by our silence.

I thought lurkers weren't supposed to influence the game?

Anyway that aside I am also now on the city gifting should be banned by the mod bandwagon .

Darrell

[Ceiliazul]

we sure can raise rule issues to the group, or shame people into following what i thought was a pretty clear application of RB values: "dont gift cities out from under conquest!"

[Krill]

FWIW I have zero idea how to actually implement that no city gifting/trading through diplo bit. I don't see much of a reason why that can't be a community rule though.

Ditto the don't gift out from conquest rule bit, I thought that was explicit.

[Bobchillingworth]

we as lurkers have to own some of this. We could have steered players away from this mess. there was very lite support against it when TBS and Azza did it, the rest of story was written in part by our silence.

Eh, if it wasn't banned when the game began then it really wouldn't be the place of lurkers to impose or "shame" the players into accepting a prohibition on giving up cities via diplo offers, after the fact. Consider this game (and more than a few others) as a lesson in why it should be banned unless voted otherwise for games going forward.

[Oxyphenbutazone]

There's a huge difference between threatening to quit the game and actually quitting the game

I honestly think that given the previous posts he will actually do it.

I'm calmer. I'm not going to rage quit regardless of what Commodore does. And I am going to offer him his refund.

However, if he burns or does anything to harm the value of that shrine city... I have a plan.

Has anyone ever actually rage-quit a game?

[Gaspar]

I think at this point Ceil's comment about fatigue has a lot to do with why some players are behaving a little badly. For everyone who isn't mackoti or plako, the turns are no small burden at this point - managing an empire on a big map in the industrial era is time consuming. When you deal with that everyday, you get some serious fatigue, even moreso when you can't win.

Not that I'm saying we probably shouldn't be more explicit regarding city gifting in the future, but I also don't think this behavior is entirely surprising.

[BRickAstley]

we as lurkers have to own some of this. We could have steered players away from this mess. there was very lite support against it when TBS and Azza did it, the rest of story was written in part by our silence.

Eh, if it wasn't banned when the game began then it really wouldn't be the place of lurkers to impose or "shame" the players into accepting a prohibition on giving up cities via diplo offers, after the fact. Consider this game (and more than a few others) as a lesson in why it should be banned unless voted otherwise for games going forward.

Agreed. And in case anyone is wondering, this is why I haven't stepped in as game admin. From what I've seen, all the cities that have changed hand without capture were either
1) Demanded before (or in a preemptive response to) an imminent invasion. Pretty close to the objective of the war that would develop for them. Doesn't break the DBAD rule.
2) Used as currency to gain gold or something else in a trade that both sides agreed to. Follows the rules of AI diplo. Doesn't break the DBAD rule.

While I agree with the "faction" that cities changing hands other than in battle would be better off not present in the game, based on the setup of this game I've never seen it fit to intervene.

[Gold Ergo Sum]

Has anyone ever actually rage-quit a game?

If I had still been the turnplayer in 19, I probably would have ragequit. I didn't log on for about a year after until Luddite mentioned his team's wacky CV and then the CFC MSDG started up. Then I didn't log in again for about another year when that all went to hell due to hubris and such.

Eventually, I always end up back. RB is my Brokeback...why can't I quit you?

It's comforting how little changes. Sullla still writing profusely about this and that. Krill still pissing and moaning profusely about this and that while throwing Darrell under various and sundry buses. Mack still mangling English in the most delightful ways while romping around like Godzilla through other people's civs. Jowy complaining about how much he hates it here but still posting constantly. And on...