[SPOILERS - PBEM17] darrelljs - Elizabeth of Egypt

[darrelljs]

Something I'd like to point out now to lurkers is that playing a leader with no early game boni is really hard to do. You need to balance growth, military, tech direction and expansion to key city sites, getting your own traits into working order to help you asap

So along those lines, here is a chat log from this morning as I played the turn. Its rather long but it does give a feel for the types of decisions Krill alludes to:

Darrell: ok
let's see what there is to see
so you want to re-route from gold/corn to grey dot?
Krill: yeah
I figure that we don't need hte happy
Darrell: probably true
commerce might be nice but its a small % at this piont
okay I am good with that
so india, we can overflow otu a warrior for purple, I like that
or overflow into a worker
Krill: ah, India
overflow into a settler
Darrell: yeah
that's the other option
Krill: means that once it regrows to size 4
Darrell: its 9 hammers
Krill: it only takes 2 turns to get to a 2 pop whip
Darrell: makes sense
Krill: 9+8+8
Darrell: for black dot actually
probably faster than brazil
Krill: that was one of hte options
Darrell: need to get that galley over
Krill: It should come back...
Darrell: hmm
road the ship or build a plains mine with the worker at china
or chop
or go back
city grows in one turn
I think we chop
Krill: question is what is worth slaving?
Darrell: then whip the granary
granary
Krill: yeah
that's probably the best option, but
and it's a fairly big but
ain't going to be anything worth while to dump pop on
one option is to leave at size 2
making worker
then slave
Darrell: that's where the plain mine cam ein
Krill: that's what, 7 worker turns?
Darrell: worker at 2 is okay
yeah
Krill: 6?
Darrell: okay, so chop the hill tile, then head north
worker from brazil shoul dgo towards grey dot
Krill: nah
Darrell: a.k.a. sagat
Krill: to purple forest
Darrell: you want two at purple?
Krill: for the other half of the granary chop
yes
Darrell: what about that corn at grey?
corn at grey better IMIO
can farm it rigth away
Krill: granaries double the usefullness of food, right?
Darrell: what food
purple won't have food for a few turns
Krill: Purple has wet corn, oasis and clams
Darrell: corn not in borders, workboat a few turns away
Krill: nor are the forests
Darrell: oasis also not in first ring
Krill: but we can chop them while borders pop
borders pop
insta granary
Darrell: border pops in 6 turns
we can chop with just one worker
23 of purple first
in fact, that's the only one we need if we do a 2->1 whip of the granary
want some sad news?
Krill: ?
Darrell: only way to get 108 beakers+gold is 0% or 100%
so its 100% this turn
there is no overflow limit on beakers at least
Krill: just get Hunting...
there is no problem with that
Darrell: id rather send one of the three workers from japan to pruple dot
in fact the timing with the boer pop works out better
Krill: er
thereare 2 forests already in purples borders that we control
21 and 23
we can chop both of them and do not have to wait
Darrell: hmm
Krill: I can't bring the game up
Darrell: thats a true statement
Krill: still taking screenshots for PBEM4
Darrell: although 21 also goes to grey
Krill: ah, screw grey
purple is better city
Darrell: gray has 4 forests total
Krill: and more useful for slaving
Darrell: purple is good for slaving
Krill: That is enough
Darrell: but it has more nice tiles to grow into
lets see...brazil also overflows into a settler
Krill: grows, tripoe slaves, overflow into worker
Darrell: usa whips worker
Krill: grows slaves settler, completes worker with overflow near enough
Darrell: japan double whip worker
lots of whips this turn
ussr...2 priess means we grow in 7
Krill: might want to take before and after screenshots
meh
use the sheep
Darrell: yeah
hmm
1 priest is grow in 2
thats faster
Krill: Can't grow in 1?
Darrell: if I worke a grass forest, indeed it can
Krill: what about hte hill?
Darrell: indeed it can then too
very nice
10/17 food in box
need 7, so fish+sheep+gm=11-2=9
Krill: To play safe, I'd say build into a galley
Darrell: -2 for city center
could be nice to finsih the warrior
Krill: hmmm
Darrell: but the whip should be a gallye
Krill: needs the happy at size 4?
Darrell: warrior in 2 turns
Krill: only if it sits there
Darrell: its at 5 unhappy right now
it needs happy at size 4 iow
gonna be unhappy next turn for one turn
Krill: if the galley gets whipped next turn, then the warrior could get finished on overflow
or you could do warrior and focus on the GP
got options there
Darrell: or the worker could get whipped next turn
we have 15/40 hammers in one alreayd, which means overflow completes the warrior
why not chop a gallye from grey?
or ussr for that matter
one thing is for sure, there is no reason to grow this turn
so I like priest over gm
unless we whip
if we whip, then gm > priest
I like grow, whip worker, overflow warrior, focus on GP
Krill: can the worker get whipped next turn?
Darrell: I recognize we need a gally
its at 15/40 hammers
so yes
then it can start chopping
Krill: I actually prefer that worker whip
Darrell: 6 forests
yeah
faster to get a settler at ussr
okay last point to address is worke rmoves
Krill: can it move move something like 98 and chop, so it is in range of the grey/purple chop?
Sent at 7:10 AM on Thursday
Darrell: 78 for grey only
no road on the mine
forest at 8, mine at 9
Krill: 79?
Darrell: 78 or 79
79 is to a grass hill
might be nice to mine it
puts us 88 of ussr
Krill: hmmm
Grey has 4 forests, right?
Darrell: if we move sagat (new worker) and ussr's worker to improve greay
Krill: It needs 2 for granary
Darrell: and one japan worker to improve purple
and 2 jampa workers to chop brazil
I think we are done
2 at purple, 2 at gray, 2 at brazil
then the 2 at brazil go to ussr for chops
Krill: Brazil doesn't need workersafter this, right?
cool
I think that is hte right way to do things
Darrell: at some point it will, but not for a loooong time
yeah
Krill: one of the Purple can then go to Grey and help clear cut
the other can farm that corn
de Krill of Fronce: I need to update this more often.
Darrell: hmm
the japan workers can build a cottage on the way without dealying when they get to the forests
not a river cottag though
okay I think we are done
Krill: yeah, that's fine
decent flexibility
Darrell: 15 pop
shoot has more in two cities lol
Krill: only thing I considered was cottaging a river grassland for USA to occasionally work
hahaha
Darrell: its got 3
Krill: how much crop yield?
Darrell: and now we have a non-river one at least
73
almost last
92 GNP is not terrilbe
but it aint 205
and 19 MFG is last by far
but we just got a bunch of workers and settlers
I'm okay with it actually
Krill: We got the chops...
we have more stored beakers than Kyan
so out of the human civs, probably first
Darrell: shoot
Krill: what happened now?
Darrell: we had 7 hammers in a warrior in japan that turned into a spear
Krill: hahaha
Darrell: 7/23
20 overflow from whip completes it but that's a dumb use of 20 overflow
Krill: nm
overflow into settler?
Darrell: definitely
for white
shoot adopted HR
he's going for a vertical strategy obvilously
Krill: ok
Darrell: remind me to put 4 EPs into nospace next turn
Krill: that makes it much easier to tech to Monarchy
Darrell: we lost there charts
yes
man we shoul dhave stuick with the HG
Krill: Meh
Kyan will get it
Darrell: 9 free pop would help
Krill: only rego has not given a none compete for it
Darrell: it almost doubles what we have now lol
Krill: well yes
you should post that

Here is a city overview, this time before ending turn:



In other news, Shoot adopted HR .



Finally, demos:



We continue to lag behind, in fact it appears we have fallen even further behind. But as we begin to convert those forests into hammers, our horizontal expansion will finish. Once we start growing vertically, things should pick up rapidly. Uh...at least that is the plan .

Darrell

[NobleHelium]

Oh, C'mon, you've named a city USA2?

I was wondering what you were going to do once you ran out of SF2 countries.

Kyan STILL has not built the HG?

[darrelljs]

Kyan STILL has not built the HG?

I know, he tricked me good on this one . Feel me once, shame on you, fool me twice...

We have three from USA (Ken, Guile, Balrog), two from Japan (Ryu, Honda), and two from Thailand (Sagat, M. Bison). Hmm...I forgot about Spain (Vega) didn't I? I can rename USA2 to Spain. I guess we can expand it to Super SF2 and include England (Cammy), Mexico (T-Hawk!), Hong Kong (Fei Long) and Jamaica (Dee-Jay).

Darrell

[Krill]

I'm not so sure it's bad for us though. We want Kyan to be in a strong position and like us so we can work together to break NoSpaces economy in short order. And Kyan plus HG when he has 9 cities will give a fairly scary CY which will get dropped onto coast and cottages in short order.

I agree that it would have been nice to, I don't know, increase our pop by a third, but meh, he tricked us. OTOH, We can get a decent deal for Lib and Astro. He goes astro, we go Lib. We take Astro with Lib (PHI Unis), NoSpace have to go Astro and chem and can't get Lib, or at the very least we need to give them a race.

Ideally, we need to get Fued, then MC, then we head straight up to Lib. Only other techs we need are Alpha, Calendar, IW and Compass that are not on a direct beeline, and we can bulb both Edu and Lib with GS. Biggest problem is getting the 2 GS AFAICT, plus the GP we are trading to StM for a GS for the Academy. I'm still not sold on the academy TBH. I think a second bulb to speed Lib is probably faster...

[Krill]

You know, we don't actually have a turn limit on the OB with NoSpace. Or an NAP.

Can we declare war when we get to Feud please? I'll talk to Kyan if you want to feel out StM and rego.

[Gold Ergo Sum]

Feel me once, shame on you, fool me twice...

Got a little kinky in chat?

I never understood why we stopped the HG plan anyway. We were only about four turns away. I didn't speak up at the time. C'est la vie.

[Krill]

It was because Kyan would have beaten us to it. But then he decided to leave it for a bit. But he got none competes with everyone except rego, whom he does not have contact with, so...

[NobleHelium]

Did we actually agree to a noncompete? I didn't read anything to that effect, but of course darrell doesn't post everything...and I don't read all the chat logs.

[Gold Ergo Sum]

I read all the chat logs and I don't remember any agreement. I thought Darrell just decided he couldn't beat him and quit. What did we get for the non-compete?

[darrelljs]

I read all the chat logs and I don't remember any agreement. I thought Darrell just decided he couldn't beat him and quit. What did we get for the non-compete?

He did not get a non-compete from us, it is as you say. I think I told him at some point I wasn't going for it, maybe he considers that a non-compete agreement.

Darrell