[NO PLAYERS] The Kibitzer Klub: PB13 Map & Lurkers

[Krill]

Which are my plans finish insutrialization get some real units: artilery, infanty , machine guners and go after some land,not from finhary of course beacsue i am tired fighting with those nuts,i need someone leger.

Called it.

[wetbandit]

Whenever this game wraps up, this is the clear frontrunner for QotM:

"i will put wolrd on fire, no one will be safe thats for sure. Who's not prepared dies."

(lightly edited but original mackoti-ness largely preserved)

I'm not even playing in this game, but just adjusted builds in other games for more units.

[Krill]

OK, so let's compare positions:

scooter: Assembly Line, Steel, Mil Sci, Physics. Down Bio, Rifling, RR, Arty. Mil Trad
Commodore: Rifling, Steel, Communism, Democracy. Down Physics, Arty, Mil Sci, Bio, RR, Mil Trad
mackoti: Bio, Assembly Line, Steel, Communism, Mil Sci, Mil Trad Physics? Down Rifling, Arty, RR.

I'm not sure of Physics on mack, don't think he has it. If he doesn't, then it basically comes down to mack being up AL, Bio Mil Trad and Mil Sci and Commodore being up Demo and RR, and Demo is unnecessary for everyone else. If scooter loses his capital, and a few inf won't save it, then his tech rate get's broken and Plako will overtake him. I think Commodore has his tech priority totally wrong, if he was going to research Biology he should have done it at the earliest opportunity. He is getting RR for defence when he has no one to defend from.

He should have gone straight for Arty. Strength 18 units that collateral. No one has units that can beat them on offence until inf, and rifles are enough to kill anything that the arty hit, and arty will even retreat from most battles. Then back track to Combustion for DD and TR so he could easily break anything and get his navy out whilst he drafts everyone else to AL and then blows past them on the way to Ind (Assembly Line>Electricity>Industrialism). He has enough time to get every unit built and once he gets to Ind he does nothing but rush buy tanks. He can build Arty>naval units>inf immediately after (land locked cities)>Tanks in that order as the tech is finished. He would even be able to build a few airships before the arty from Physics. If Commodore had followed this path, I feel he would have gotten Arty done already, before getting Steam Power.

Oh well, maybe in the future...

[2metraninja]

Whenever this game wraps up, this is the clear frontrunner for QotM:

"i will put wolrd on fire, no one will be safe thats for sure. Who's not prepared dies."

(lightly edited but original mackoti-ness largely preserved)

I'm not even playing in this game, but just adjusted builds in other games for more units.

Hoho, good ones

[Bobchillingworth]

I guess this is a "controversial" opinion or whatever, but I don't think Commodore has played a particularly great game. His current position has everything to do with scooter (and pindicator) being unwilling to ever pressure him militarily, being tired of fighting him from past games, and having no other neighbors. With no real threat to his empire he has gotten away with running a ridiculous empire with little production, a paper military and a bunch of strung-out island holdings. Sure, he could build a genuine military now, with the Kremlin and production from Universal Suffrage, but he never should have been able to float to that position. His one military venture of the game was a failed war against WLP- he only got what he wanted in the end because WLP was trapped in a life-or-death struggle against Ichabod. His current plan to invade WLP and refusal to consider piling in on Scooter strike me as enormously misguided and essentially consigning himself to a third or fourth-place finish.

[Krill]

Not really controversial, it's fairly true. On the other hand, Commodore has very poor land: he choose the best strategy to get to the late game (this contrasts with choosing this strategy in other scenarios such as Sullla in PB16 where he had potentially the best land in the game, and certainly the best start, so could have taken control much sooner by killing a neighbour or two). Arguably if mackoti wasn't in such a strong position, Commodore would be less hesitant to attack scooter, or at least should be. I think Commodore should be respected for the play up to Democracy and Communism, he has gotten Kremlin and SoL, after all, but after that...well, I'm going to wait to judge, because hindsight will be useful here.

[pindicator]

Mack has physics, he beat Scooter to it for the free GS by a turn.

And for the record, I wanted to attack Commodore all game long but got vetoed every time

As for Commodore's prospects, he just doesn't have that motivation to win. Mackoti has it again. Everybody else is demoralized or over-states their opponents' situation and so plays defensively. If Commodore had started rush buying troops as soon as he saw that stack enter Scooter's land (and remember, he has EP vision on scooter), then he could have positioned himself well. But I think he's stuck on the notion of attacking an era ahead, when attacking scooter would be so much easier pickings right now.

[pindicator]

So i was chatting with Commodore about an upcoming game he wants to do, when all of the sudden...

Commodore:Yeah
Ooooooh
No, I didn't have vision on Timbers
Scooter's spent some EP, looks like.
implications dawn
pindicator: you have city vision, right?
i mean, you saw what was there the turn before, didn't you?
Commodore: Nope,
I just saw the continued sapping of all units to the front
That's...significant, though.
pindicator: yep
Commodore: Particularly because its Scooter
pindicator: how so?
i don't have people tendencies read as well as you and gaspar do
Commodore: You guys have kind of a so-so capital and a huge empire.
Lewwyn's way is open and his power is vast, so he'll probably raze Trailblazers
He was in PB6
He knows all about 100 CKNs >>> 20 rifles.
pindicator: definitely someone with real world experience in that dept
Commodore: Mackoti or Plako, losing that cap, would be on the back foot
Scooter...thinks like a dueler.
Capital loss, it's game over man
See the Turn of Devastation, PBEM 34s
pindicator: i need to revisit that one
Commodore: Heh
You were in it. :P
pindicator: i know, but i mailed it in pretty hard that game
much like pb15
Commodore: But anyway, Nakor's land is really good
Your NE city is on the isles.
Vikings can easily shrug off the loss of that cap.
Not sure if Scooter can.
checks
No rifling.
Ow.
pindicator: so does this new insight affect your plans any?
Commodore: Hrm
Need thought
pindicator: well, i'm not selfish. feel free to share with all the lurkers when you decide :P
Commodore: Trouble is, Cyneheard is next in line if it completely breaks Scooter.

Was trying to get him to pump him for info without leading him, and I'm not happy that I confirmed the "that's significant" comment with a "yep" response. Hope I didn't have any other gaffs, but it's easy to see that Commodore just realized how serious things are for scooter. Looking forward to see what conclusions he draws.

[Dp101]

such as Sullla in PB16

Wait, what? Did he make another fake account to play in another pitboss?

[Qgqqqqq]

Yeah, he played as Mikehendi.