Can someone explain to me the connection between power costs of maneuverability and overall cost/size?
It seems to me that maneuverability is extremely cheap compared power draws of other items.
Table 9-7 says the power cost of larges increase by 100 for each level of maneuverability. However, in practice it seems the highest maneuverability costs 100 and everything less that that is interpolated lower.
In fact, figure 9-8 on the same page shows the contradiction between the chart and in-game values.

Hi guys,
 
Plenty of you probably already know about it (as I found some super old threads HERE and HERE ) but for those who don’t know or haven’t seen it in years I thought I’d spread the word on an awesome fan project that’s still going and has utterly blown me away.
 
Master of Magic – Implode’s Multiplayer Edition is a brilliant opensource Java MoM engine rebuild that is far more closer to completion then any other MoM fan remake I've seen! It supports larger maps, up to 14 players (either Human or AI), and any modern windows resolution like HD 4K etc. The author Implode intends to expand on the original MoM experience but with minimal changes to the core gameplay and graphics that we all love.
 
Implode the creator of MoM-IME has been working on this project for over 12yrs now and isn’t getting much support these days so if you’re a huge Master of Magic fan and you’ve dreamed of playing against 13 other wizards in massive slaughterfest over 2 giant worlds in high resolution then get yours butts over to the sourceforge page and try out the latest demo and offer your support!
 

 
I love the improved battle graphics eg how he’s done a LOTR-Weta workshop trick of grabbing a few guys and replicating them into larger groups. Makes you feel like your commanding large armies instead of little squads and big monsters who are upscaled and not replicated look much scarier now as they tower over the little armies! Also like the Civ style territory borders and how the game supports simultaneous turns like AoW which would be great for multiplayer games.
 
For anyone interested here’s a video I recorded of his game in 1080P (FYI it doesn’t go full screen until the map loads)...

Part 1 covers me exploring the starting an empire (fast forwarding through slow bits):

 

Part 2 covers me attacking some neighbours and starting a new game in the Myrran dark world:
https://youtu.be/gepiu3CfWOA?list=PLZqna...bIkFqjRBxQ

NOTE: This video was made with the 2015 WIP 0.9.6.3 release. There have been multiple releases since adding things such as treasure rewards and hero items. In late 2016 Implode started work on the much anticipated enemy wizard global AI (AI build cities & armies, casts spells etc) so I can’t wait for that! Battle AI is functional however so you can still have a fun monster/treasure hunting RPG style game in the current build.
 
Download latest demo build from:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/momime/

Old MoM-IME forum:
http://mom.pjj.cc/forum/index.php
 
If anyone's interested I also run a Master of Magic facebook group here:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/MasterOfMagicGame/
 
For more information on this and many other MoM related games & mods check out my MoM Legacy Games page here:
http://blakessanctum.x10.mx/Games/MoM/

Hey all, it has been 3 weeks since dtay has logged in to Realms Beyond, or played the save.  This civ is currently playing a competitive role in the game, as Augustus Caesar of Sumeria.

dtay's spoiler thread is here
PB27 Tech thread is here

Please reply in this thread if you are interested in taking over.

EDIT: we also need to have a lurker check for the game password in dtay's thread and post it in spoiler tags here. Thanks!

Im not sure if you guys know about this but, I would really like to see something done with it.

When MOM was released, I think some guy in Washington DC made a program on DOS and actually sold it for MOM. The program would let you play MOM online multiplayer either by dialup or maybe on some sort of networks, hot seat with a single computer and Im not sure but, I think it also let you spread more magicians on the map meaning more AI. What it did do is enable hot seat with AI and play online.

Could someone take this and somehow decompile and recompile with a fix as to make this work with the patch? I know this hack in the day was possibly no where close to bug free, I didn't try it hard. It did work.

Equally, I have it around somewhere, with the manual and the rest of the files but, I think its online as well. Im not sure where it is.

You know, it would be nice to add what he did for hot seat and maybe even get the ground for a MOM multiplayer through dosbox IPX? emulation if someone gets it up and running.

I know it exists, somewhere. It can be fixed in case of errors and unified with this patch? Thinking of it, Im not sure if I had to crack the thing itself, considering it was a total hack itself...

I wrote up what my data says is a pretty good combat formula on the CivFanatics forum:  https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/h...la.606147/

Damage = 30 * e^(StrengthDifference/25) * randomFactor

randomFactor seems to be +/- (0-25)%, or 0.75 to 1.25

+10 Strength means 150% damage and resistance.

Every strength point multiplies your damage dealt (and divides damage received) by ~1.041

An Army (3 units, +17 strength) deals 2x damage and receives 0.5x damage in return.  This means that an Army should be able to kill at least 3 equivalent units in a fight.  Possibly even 4.  Definitely cost effective!!!  Corps too.

(November 21st, 2016, 00:24)Gaspar Wrote: Decided with the new patch and how I'm enjoying reading SG1, I would propose another succession game. I've kind of slipped off playing Civ6 and the thing that really strikes me when I was playing is that it was going to require some serious time investment to get the strategies down precisely. So I'm going to propose a relatively simple variant as well, given that my personal bent is more to just get more comfortable with the mechanics of the game.

I'm also curious at just how many people there are in the community who are currently interested in this sort of thing...

Civ: Cleopatra/Egypt
Difficulty: Emperor
Game Settings: Standard speed, Ancient era
Map Settings: Small, Continents

Variant Rule: Only international trade routes

Not the most exciting variant but I picked it for a few reasons. 1. The SG1 guys are exploring the limited route thing and I thought it might be interesting to explore the other half of the underused mechanic. As such, Egypt seemed a nice hedge pick, since they do get a slight bonus to international routes. 2. I don't want to go to heavy on variant play just yet because I'm most interested in better understanding the game. 3. I'm not that great. Succession game typically raises your ability roughly a difficulty level and I didn't want to make it too challenging just yet.

I am open to tweaking the setup if someone has a great idea. I debated going for Standard or even Large size because part of what I'd like to explore is efficiently managing a large-ish empire in Civ6 but I'm also not keen on it taking forever to complete turnsets in the later eras.

Following standard-ish rules otherwise - 24/48 got it, play it and 25/15/10/10... for turnsets. Looking for 4-5 players and so on. Sign-up ahoy!

(November 24th, 2016, 13:59)Gaspar Wrote: Ok that's five.

Gaspar
ReallyEvilMuffin
Sareln
Pindicator
Ruined Everything

Ray had hinted that one of the early changes to Psilons after the classic version is finished is focusing on their pacifist nature and turning their weapons research to Poor.  Fair enough.

I think a fun angle with Psilons would be to let the player choose one of the remaining fields to be Excellent at rather than the typical Good.  This adds some replayability and some racial flavor (as long as they are the only race to have this customization at the beginning of the game).  

My question to the MoO gods here is: Would there be an obvious go-to field? (I'm guessing not force fields...).  Construction, Computers, and Planetology all seem to make decent arguments.

If there is a no-brainer, best field then perhaps this modded version of Psilons needs more work.

Wassup.

I'm late with this report, but only because I'm lazy.

As has become common I didn't finish.  At least this time it was for better reasons - I took a lot more time than usual thinking about what to do compared to Civ4.  I was trying not to look up strategies and figure strategy out for myself, but with the subpar UI that wasn't very likely.  (Need to do some forum reading to understand how all the undocumented stuff works, and pretty hard not to see some strategy that way).  Still spend a lot more time thinking.   
Oh, if I type 'Hatty' I mean 'Cleo'.  Habits hard to break

Started off, founded on starting square, and quickly found that we are bad at geography (probably old news to those reading the earlier Roman writeups

For those who didn't see, there are tea and jade (both lux) under the popup.
Rome rushes through culture faster than any other civ presumably with the free monuments.  I went with the +1 hammer over faith/gold policy for early pantheon.
Barbs got intense early!  Poor warrior died horribly

Sorry, I didn't take great notes on early build/tech order.  Cumae was founded in 2720 BC, this is from a few turns later after I started spending gold

Would eventually buy the other cows and the 3rd-ring wheat for total of 5 purchases!  Wasn't sure how fast city state borders would pop, turns out they seem pretty slow so may have been ok to wait for the cows.  I got three envoys for first meeting (Mil Kabul, Culture Nan Madol, Gold Jakarta) and have to say that the capital bonus in the early game seems more unbalanced by a good deal vs the 30 gold in civ5 for first meeting.  
One nice thing was being able to use the "build units faster" policy to assemble a credible anti-barb force, then swap into the "+str against barbs" when using them.  Only my little army had nothing to do really once assembled:

Yeah, besides killing one scout-warrior above and hampering other faraway scouting barbs actually didn't do much.  Cities don't have the ranged attack w/o walls but they're basically invulnerable to early barbs.  The above scary party would chase units that I'd hide in my cities then the barbs would suicide on them (AI bug?  they only seemed to attack cities with units inside).  could have given me major pillage pains but they seem not to ever pillage?  and then the camp-spear ran out of camp here.  I guess having a barb raid come up with a settler/escort on the move could be hairy.  Later on in the game, still plenty of camps (lots of unsettled space) but the city-states had so many spare units running around that they cleaned them up, and the barbs never really got stronger units either.   The geography was probably favorable to me though with Rome on a corner and the lakes creating narrow isthmus, so not that likely for barbs to wander from the main landmass w/o hitting a city state first.
Political Philosphy in 2120 BC, went Republic with this loadout

I think I got to change policies a little too often to the point of abusive.  for example think I built almost every settler/builder from here one with a policy boost (while also spending time in other stuff) and rarely had to sit in the +prod for more than a turn.  Other things were often taking Land Surveyors and buying lots of tiles then swapping out 2-3 turns later, or swappign the first two diplo policies when you were almost at envoy-earning influnece or on a civic discovery that gave Envoy.  But maybe that's Rome and Nan Madol (more on them later), other civs can't do this as easily.
City #3

I went back and forth on locations for this and didn't make the best decision.  It was ok but really should have been my 5th or so (esp since opposite direction of the AI's).  Didn't realize at time of foundign that couldn't build aqueduct/bath and would be longterm gimped on housing; also didn't realize that iron didn't matter because A)legions don't need it and B) would need two anyways or the silly encampment-for-1-strat resource.  

Should have waited a couple more turns for my army to clear barbs here, was a much better city.  Ostia would go where the hurt barb spear is but not until 6 turns later or so.  About this time I was going for late religion, built holy site at Rome and took the +2 Prophet point policy.

Great stroke of luck for me.  Cleo got dumb here.  She had conquered another CS early before I met them, and I worried here as well (would have built/gifted a couple units if you could still do it like civ5), but Cleo failed to do much of anything (NM had a narrow isthmus in the Egypt-direction, basically guaranteed that 1UPT would not be able to swarm it, both sides traded some warriors and slingers but the city never got damaged). I got to 3 envoys early (one free first meeting, one normal, one 'send trade route' quest) and the lord ability (+2 culture in any coastal district) applies to coastal city centers and was a big help for basically all my cities after the first two.   Lucky was that I could sit on that forever - the war meant Egypt never sent envoys, and it was out of the way that no other AI ever found it; I kept it the whole game w/o having to spend more envoys.  Also luck that this lord-bonus seemed way, way stronger than the other ones on offer .
Reached a pantheon T72.  Took God of the Sea (fishing boats on sea resources all give +1 production).  More on religion later.  Finally met 3rd and 4th AI's (tojo, Sal) on same turn a bit later, with another bug with Tojo's picture showing for both of them.  Techwise I was beelining Apprenticeship (one strategy thing I saw was "beeline production or the tech/civic escalation of district costs gets to the point where you can't build them.)

yeah that's why religion later.  Lost the prophet and had to go all the way to 120 instead of 60, major drag.  I was ahead (forget by how much) but I guess the AI gold-spent or faith-spent on it.  Not sure I like this new feature of GP.  It seemed uneven as well with regards to cost - this time the cost increased but other times they did not and it's very frustrating; you have an unknown chance the AI will pay to jump ahead of you in the GP pool and unknown cost after that happens (and for non -GProphets, what the next great person of that type does).  Building wonders (and risking losing them) seems much 'better' in the sense that you know exactly the effects wil be if you lose the race.

Also got a bit of sour taste here, with the new builder policy at Feudalism replacing the old one, I wanted to stack them sometimes.  The hoverover for "policies obsoleted" is way less obvious than say the civ4 tech tree having the red X over the wonder.  Still I have several partially-built workers at the time I got Feudalism so I kinda-sorta got to double up those policies for one batch.  

Some planning.  I was 'part-rush-buying' districts - buy tiles with gold to plop them down but not necessarily work on them before your civ advancement makes them cost ever more hammers.  
In general I went
-Ind Zone at each of my first 4 cities, all had places with +3 or +4 adjacency eventually.  Then I realized that spending hammers to get hammers on a 30-40 turn payback (for the district) or an 87-turn payback (the Workshop building) probably wasn't a great thing overall.  (the +1 mine bonus from Apprenticeship is the better part of that tech by far...)
-Early holy site at Rome
-couple of campuses but not many
-one encampment at Cumae that sat undone for a gazillion years.  I thought I could use one military when placing it, but then barb threat disappeared so sat around.
-lots of harbors and comm. hubs for trade routes

Hi Kongo! Glad to see you are settling something as lots of AI's are lame in that regard (note the open space on the minimap...)

You're joking, right?  We're miles apart and you're DOWing + bribing another in the very next turn?  (I got notified Kongo-Arabia on same interturn, maybe Sal actually instigated Joint War but that's also crazy, he's lost his capital to Japan - and still in war with them, almost as far away as Kongo and only known for a few turns more).  

Ok fine whatever I'll steal your UNESCORTED SETTLER LEFT NEXT TO MY SCOUT WHEN YOU DOW'D.  Jesus.  Looking back, I totally should have sent my scout after the builder too instead of escoring the settler back (enough neutral-to-me, hostile-to-Sal japanese warriors to protect the settler long enough to meet it with another unit from my core).  It was a ways back, map coming later with next wave of settlers.

So, here's religion.  I guess I was underwhelmed by the boni and such (Took Work Ethic and the founder belief +2 gold per city of your faith).  They fixed the Desert Folklore problem (where your pantheon gave you tons of faith from working terrain that is supposed-to-be-bad like the other pantheons, but isn't b/c Civ5 floodplains triggered DF and desert hills have same yield as other hills, unless you have Petra and then they are better than most special resource tiles, and you get widespread religion benefits with maybe spending hammers on one shrine early).  Now you have to build a holy site + its buildings to get 2nd or 3rd religion, and probably have to build multiple ones to spread it fast and fight off AI's spreading their faith.  But, they left the benefits of different beliefs same or similar scale as civ5.  I think passive spread works more or less the same, but definitely fewer persons converted per missionary use (although I guess missionary use costs less faith in Civ6 than civ5 until you build a large number)..  So it seems to be pretty weak payoff.
In most ways the map was lucky (good land, I think, near the Rome start, useful city states for the early capital bonus, tons of space between the other AI's) but the one not so lucky thing was that Cleo was the strongest faith AI and she pushed her religion well, made it harder to establish my own.  It does seem the AI's listen to the 'please stop converting me' but you can't ask until they do it once, and can't do much if they convert nearby CS to pressure you when you still are trickling faith to your first missionary.  I wound up getting my faith inside the "colosseum core" and the island city, good for +2 gold/city and +5-10% production from Work Ethic in about 7 cities, and was fighting with other missionaries at the outer part of my empire when I retired.  (I was only using missionaries, no idea how the Theological Brawl works yet).  This was ok but not huge.  If I replayed the game I think the best bonus for hammer spent might have just been to use God King some, get the fishing boat pantheon, then call it a day and not go after religion.  

Jumping ahead, did enhance.  Yeah also not great options here.  Didn't realize that one apostle only gives one more of two more beliefs.  Other options seemed silly (30% cheaper missionaries, which you spend 250 faith on to save ~35-40 over your next ones, meh better to just buy them at full price and get them converting sooner), or just not that good (the 'cathedral' buildings I think only built on holy sites, so you have to build a HS in most cities to really use them).  After this I didn't get another apostle, just missionaries for converting.  

Wow, 100 turns into the game for Hatty to make a settler.  Location doesn't look bad but wow that's far away from her - red boxes on minimap are her lands + new city.  (It was actually her 3rd city due to conquering a CS).  Land here is solid but not obvious it's better than several locations near her capital, odd.  (At least she didn't send a settler a long ways and put it in my face or right next to another AI).  

Here's my expansion overview at 1AD, too bad you can't zoom out very far so have to paste two together.  Red box was one more coming fairly soon, yellows are planned Colosseum and two more eventual fillers (within 6 tiles of Colosseum).  Antium was with the Kongo swiped settler.  Rush bought one more archer there due to war (also hit 3 for machinery boost).  So these other new cities were mostly fishing villages.  Mediolanum was a good site (and I learned having it off river but within 1 tile of Mountain for Bath) but I kinda got caught up doing other stuff and didn't give it the worker help it really needed.  It also had problems with slow border pops (not coastal so no Nan M bonus). More on those Kongo warriors in a sec.
 Other news:  I built Hanging gardens at Lugdunum (mostly with just two forest chops) and Pyramids at Cumae (one chop  plus 4-5 turns production?) in late BC years.  Didn't want to lose races for wonders, or land/settler races so had avoided for a long time until they looked too cheap to pass up.  As it turns out the AI's built hardly any wonders or settlers, so next game may go for these earlier.  And was closing in on more advanced Govt (culture flying with Rome + NM + wide expansion with lots of coastal cities, no Culture districts yet


Also amused by these late huts; some found late because AI seemed to be bad at scouting, the relic was between me and Nan Madol and I just missed it for a while, the 'hut on jungle' graphic actually a bit hard to see.  Popping half of a Medieval civic or tech seems a little weird, this was one thing I thought Civ5 > Civ4 (can only pop ancient techs, or culture that matters a lot in the early game but not later when its 5% of a policy cost).  And more amusement, I DOW'd myself apparently!

So, one of the logs said a CS ally of mine DOW'd Victoria of England (haven't met her yet! geez).  Think it was another joint DOW by Saladin (we had signed white peace earlier, he hated me b/c he founded Islam and I had a relgion but also liked me becuase I had 2nd or 3rd place Faith rate...).  Sigh.  Meanwhile the fighting finally came in the other war (Kongo wouldn't sign peace)

Yeah, AI is pretty bad here.  3 warriors not a threat.  Their pathfinding was odd too, kinda started going for Antium, then they chased Trader, and kind of circled back/split up (maybe because got wounded, maybe fighting some allied CS units in the area?).  Could have sworn they crossed ove that Trader of mine a turn or two before this pic but somehow it survived.  And you can see they bounced right off a legion in the forest.  I built a roman fort later on the road but didn't really need it.  Think one or two more Kongo units headed towards Antium later but CS allies roughted them up, no cities ever got attacked.
2nd part coming Monday night (pacific time) hopefully.

Realms Beyond Civilization 6 Adventure 2: The Moon and the Stars

Sponsor: Sullla
Opening Date: Saturday, November 19th
Duration: Four Weeks



Map Script: Continents
Map Edits: None
Game Speed: Normal
Difficulty: Emperor
Civilization & Leader: Saladin of Arabia
World Size: Small
Opponents: Six (one above the default)
Rules: Standard
Victory: Spaceship
Version: First Patch

Scenario: The goal in this game is to win a Spaceship victory at the fastest possible date. As Saladin, your civ will be guaranteed a Great Prophet to found a religion. Your challenge will be to balance faith and science together with the goal of launching the spaceship first. Is it better to focus on getting a religion quickly, to make use of Saladin's Madrasa unique building and Righteousness of the Faith unique ability? Or is it better to skip religion entirely to focus more directly on science? We don't know and it should be fun to find out.

Scoring: Fastest finish by Spaceship. Other victory types will not be counted in the scoring. Players may need to be careful about avoiding an unwanted Cultural victory if the game lasts long enough - watch out!



Closing Date: Monday, December 19th. We have traditionally made Mondays our closing day, and I think we should continue that tradition. Note that this is a scored event, which means NO SPOILERS about your game while playing. Do not post information about your game while it is in play, or afterwards until the finish date. The time to post reports will be on the closing day, where everyone will share the results of their individual games. If anyone is looking for more collaborative Civ6 events, feel free to start up another Succession Game or try to get some Civ6 MP rolling. The Epics/Adventures are Single Player events, and we take the no spoilers rule seriously.

Starting Save Located Here