Epic 28: Compromise's Report

I'm really not too experienced on Deity. Most of what I think I know is derived from watching TMIT or Absolute Zero "Let's Play" youtube videos. So...let's see how the Maze script affects Deity play.

"Wonderful" strategy: It looks like all the land masses connect in a maze map, so there are no overseas foreign trade routes. Nevertheless, they are foreign routes, so I suspect the most important wonder in the game is, like most heavy-on-the-water maps, the Great Lighthouse.

With that in mind, we look at our starting location: Nice hills, Good food, and an elephant for (effectively) another improved hill. Unless moving the warrior 1N reveals something amazing (it didn't), we settle in place.

Our early scouting is directed fully to the north and is pretty successful:



I am fairly afraid of barbarians, so after popping a scout from a hut, we leave him up north to fogbust. In fact, that spot looks like a great hammer-spot....

I had high hopes for that scout and more huts, but all he found was a lion...and some great land that should belong to Brennus. (We'll try to steal it though):



The total lack of Copper anywhere nearby was a bit concerning, but for rapid Great Lighthouse, our tech path was pretty much set:

Mining
Bronzeworking
Sailing
Masonry

...and chop and whip into the Lighthouse.

Next up is Animal Husbandry because our northern hammer-city has beef. We are happy to see that we have Horses, but without rivers to connect them, they are rather far away. I suspect we need to put our third city over there to grab them with fewer roads (and to make a play for the Stone up there....)

Another trick learned from T-Hawk and other good players who play on Deity:



Three turns till the Great Lighthouse, or two population to get it now. Well, considering that our entire early-game strategy depends on this wonder: We whip now!

(I actually saved the game here because I was curious to see where they AI was. I forgot about this until writing this report. One AI had 5 turns to go on the Great Lighthouse and didn't whip it, so my whip was unnecessary. But I certainly don't regret the sacrifice!)


With the Great Lighthouse in the bag, we advance on a secondary objective: the circumnavigation bonus. Workboats in opposite directions. And while Writing gets us foreign trade routes, it also allows us east-west access through their cities.

We discover The Wheel and Hunting before going for Aesthetics (discovered in 700BC at the same time as the circumnavigation bonus) in the typical Deity tradebait research path.

Our third city grabs horses:




In 625BC, our first great person is born. At odds of (Scientist-44%/Merchant-56%), we get a Merchant. I promptly burn him on Currency. This is the same turn Asoka feels that we are so pathetic that he gives us Mysticism as a pity tech.

This is...ironic. Asoka has been building all the wonders in the game (except our Lighthouse, of course), and he is close enough and poorly defended enough to make a great target.

It is now that I realize how fortunate our placement of the city of Horsegrab is: Not only have we made it impossible for the AI to place cities along that strip of land because of a 3-tile minimum distance, but we can also open a "Dutch-only" passage with that most a-maze-ing of improvements...a Fort!

But first, we get some happiness and trap Brennus a bit with some cities to the Northwest:



Also, we get an Artist from Music in 25BC. He is used a bit later for a Golden Age to build our Elepult-upon-Galleys assault team.

It takes much longer to get my maze-busting troops assembled than I'd expected. I think this is because of the extreme scarcity of forests to chop. And to throw a wrench into the invasion plans, just before we declare on Asoka...



...He builds the Apostolic Palace. This could be...painful. As the founder of Judaism, he will all but certainly be the AP resident (I even vote for Charlemagne instead of abstaining, but with Lincoln's votes, Asoka still wins).

The good news: he didn't build the AP in Delhi! So...we'll change the invasion plan a little bit:



Our invasion force is perfect! Six cats (two die softening up the defenses) and 4 elephants are on the ground. Three more of each are on the boats that have come through the Fort canal. Bombay is burned to the ground, and no resolution is ever passed by the AP!

Of course...the Church of the Nativity and the Oracle also burn, but hey...what are ya gonna do?

We take Vijayanagara in 640AD, Delhi in 840AD.

At this point, something irritating happens: I decide to completely wipe out Asoka since he only has one city left. Even though it will take a while because I have to go by land (he has Caravels, I have Galleys), I figure it will be worth it.

But then he vassals to Charlemagne! That's just irritating. I know others have commented, but I just don't think it's reasonable that an AI who is getting crushed can capitulate to an AI you are at peace with and drag them into war with you. Ah well.

In 1010AD, we take Asoka's last city, and then turn toward Charlemagne. He is a fairly big troop builder, so I can't attack near his core. But:

We take Pisa:



And Mainz:



And then, I noticed where Charlemagne had sent the nasty stack he'd had near his capital earlier...



I guess I hadn't expected that! He moved on my newly acquired Indian cities which were, of course, totally undefended....

So, peace with Charlemagne it is!

I certainly didn't need a city that would be utterly crushed by Charlemagne's culture, so I gifted Mainz to Brennus.

But then...that gave me a "traded with our worst enemy" penalty with many of the other AIs. Sigh. Can't win. Oh well.

After this, the game was pretty much won. I declared on Lincoln with Cannons, War Elephants and Cuirassiers. Lincoln bribed Churchill against me, but he was essentially useless (made peace in 1490AD).

Lincoln bribed Charlemagne on me too. No problem...Charlemagne took a peace offer in 1500AD.

Lincoln capitulated to me in 1560AD, just after the capture of Philadelphia and its Versailles. I took the capitulation as soon as it was offered, just to be sure he didn't cap to someone else.

Declare on Charlemagne in 1580AD. Churchill bribed against me (1685AD). Churchill gave me 200 gold for peace in 1625AD. (Some AIs never learn....)

By 1740AD, our cavalry forced Charlemagne to capitulate to us. This was just after Churchill declared on us *again* (1730AD). Seriously?

Well, once we took London, he capped (1810AD).

After one series with Pericles as the head of the UN, we were elected (1828AD). Our very first vote stopped Pericles from overrunning Brennus:



I probably could have won a diplomation victory, but I thought it best to make it a pure domination, so I didn't bring up a diplo victory petition. With Pericles forced to make peace, we overran Brennus ourselves. We planted lots of land-grabbing cities, and finally won:




Final Thoughts: Thanks T-Hawk, this was a lot of fun. Especially the early game and the plotting of the first couple wars.

The choice of AIs was interesting for this map. Because they were all fairly peaceful (except Brennus, who was hemmed in very early), they wouldn't go to war against each other. But they would let themselve be bribed against us. Clever.

I'm curious to see if anyone goes for a peaceful victory. I wonder if it's possible on a map where the many coasts benefit the player's unique bonuses: the only financial civ (3-commerce from the sea) and the dikes (a hammer from the sea also).

The end was a bit of a slog, but overall the game certainly earned the Epic designation in my book!

Looking if theres any interest for a new PBEM starting somewhere at the end of the month (Say ... somewhere between Yule and newyears) ... my idea would be something close to 26, although prehaps with slightly bigger islands instead (say size of the startup island there, 2-4 (depending on how tight a fit) cities per island)

tentative banlist would be something in line of:

Vikings

Financial

Great Lighthouse
Colossus

...

Anyones interest tickled?

New thread, since the clock is off...

(December 2nd, 2012, 16:02)zakalwe Wrote:

Quote:Hi again,

To elaborate, a city 1E of ivory is the only way we can dotmap the south without blocking out valuable seafood. The tile 2E of ivory is a peak, and 2E 1S would leave the seafood unreachable. So we cannot really budge on that. Consider that there is lots of good land in the north, including a marble resource right outside our borders. We're not claiming any of that land.

From our point of view, what you're asking is essentially that we halt any and all expansion in your direction, while allowing you to peacefully settle another 3-4 new cities all along the borders of our existing cities. So we really don't feel that we're being unreasonable.

This is pretty hardball, and just clarifies our stance and doesn't actually offer anything new at all. It's the right stance to take if we think they're just fishing for bonus concessions. But if we fear that they might not be bluffing, we could leave the door open for further concessions with a third paragraph. (I.e. we grab something in the north instead, or some other kind of concession.) Or maybe just offer some token concession, for their pride. A fast worker on the turn that we settle the ivory city, for example.

(December 2nd, 2012, 16:29)plako Wrote: Bad news. M3 and Gillette have NAP. I think we need to offer a concession like a fast worker to get that spot:

Quote:me: hi

hitanykey: Heya.

me: any news?

hitanykey: Typing on phone so may be slow.
News on what?

me: ok. np. I'm probably equally slow from my keyboard
Just about anything. Gongrats on GLH btw.

hitanykey: Thx. Oh just realized I didn't send the email I drafted up.
Gillette okayed a nap between us until T100.

me: ok - we're still having discussions

edit. Aargh clock is again on wrong time. My message is now way back there. This was my new version of the message. Not gonna rush playing this turn:

Quote:To elaborate, a city 1E of ivory is the only way we can dotmap the south without blocking out valuable seafood. The tile 2E of ivory is a peak, and 2E 1S would leave the seafood unreachable. So we cannot really budge on that. Consider that there is lots of good land in the north, including a marble resource right outside our borders. We're not claiming any of that land.

However since our primary goal is to maintain peaceful relationship we're ready to come forward. What would be enough to make the positioning acceptable. We could e.g. gift fast worker when we settle the city in question.

(December 2nd, 2012, 09:16)zakalwe Wrote:

(December 2nd, 2012, 16:22)plako Wrote: I like the 1st part not so much 2nd. 2nd argumentation is hard to justify, when we consider where the fair border would be.

The fair border would be further west in the north. Besides, the point is that we've already settled up to the border, while they haven't.

Anyway, perhaps a better strategy is to "counter-offer" something even more unpalatable in the north.

One of the teams in the Erebus in the Balance pitboss game is down to a single player, and he has expressed a desire for some help. Erebus in the Balance is a modmod of Fall from Heaven, focused on multiplayer balance.

The game is currently at turn 99. You would be joining Hart on team 2. See the setup thread for game details.

We've really got to come up with a better naming convention for these reported duels. Seriously, this thing is called PBEM5s? That's dumb. Why not Duel23 or something? ANGER - I have it.

Speaking of anger. I want to beat Commodore. So let's try doing that shall we. Traditional space-filling item that's not really very important goes next, followed by an explanatory post which is probably boring but I like to pretend people care about it, followed by pretty pictures and terrible attempts at humor mixed with the occasional helpful caption. BEGIN.

Siege of the Dragon

16-21 players

Start Time: Sunday, December 9th 22:00 GMT

Days will be 48 hours, Nights will be 24 hours.

Roles will be given out just before the game starts. Game will not start until all roles are handed out, however. (Lynch deadlines will still be 2200 GMT regardless of when game officially starts)


Players (in order of sign up)

Red= minimum number
Blue= preferred number

1. Novice
2. Ichabod
3. Pindicator
4. Zakalwe
5. Qgqqqq
6. Uberfish
7. Lewwyn
8. Waterbat
9. Mattimeo
10. Serdoa
11. Rowain
12. Bigger
13. Azza
14. Selrahc
15. Slowcheetah
16.MJW
17.
18.
19.
20.
21.


Revealed game information

-> You will not be lied to in your Role PM
-> there will be both mayor votes and lynch votes. First day will have both. If the new mayor dies, there will be another election, but not until then. It is possible to lynch the mayor if there is a majority of votes on him at deadline, just like any other citizen.
-> full role descriptions (of the dead) will not be revealed until game's end
-> there will be at least one protective role
-> there will be at least one passive protective ability
-> the Dragon will be represented as a player (Serial Killer)

Rules
-> no forum camping
-> no direct quoting from your Role PM
-> must vote (for lynch) every day
-> players cannot edit their posts

(those who do not vote for two consecutive 'in-game' days will be mod-killed)

Extras
-> here is a thread I started earlier this year. Not completely relevant, but enough to link it in this thread I should think.
http://realmsbeyond.net/forums/showthrea...ght=dragon

We all knew this was going to happen, eh? Tokugawa of the Celts is clearly the next step.

I'm playing Boudica (Agg,Chm) of Japan (Fishing, The Wheel):


VS.

Scooter, who is playing Charlemagne(Pro,Imp) of China(Agriculture, Mining):

I thought it would make sense to open a dedicated thread for game bargains, especially since the holiday season is approaching fast.
So if you happen to stumble across a great offer let us know about it!

I will go ahead and link to the "The Humble THQ bundle":

http://www.humblebundle.com/

Pay what you want for a bundle including

- Darksiders
- Metro 2033
- Red Faction Armageddon
- Company of Heroes
- Company of Heroes: Opposing Fronts
- Company of Heroes: Tales of Valor
- Saints Row: The Third (if you pay more than the average 5.17$)

Anyone interested in a Civ 5 PBEM? I've just bought the game + G&K at the Thanksgiving Promotion in Steam and I've been wanting to try a MP game.

I realize it might be difficult to find people interested in trying it, especially since, as far as I can tell, I can't play the game without the expansion, since I own both. So I'd need to find people with interest + that own the expansion, which, frankly, I don't think is very likely.

Anyway, let us see. Anyone interested?

After Mackoti left Realms Beyond, his cousin took over his civs in PBEM 41 and 43. Mackoti's cousin has been missing since Friday, however.

43's players don't seem to have a consensus yet, but 41 is definitely looking for a sub.